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Why is childbirth painful?
Thu, 2008-06-05 00:28 — flower
I know this it not really on topic, but a subject of interest nevertheless - at least to me, who's been troubled by it my whole life. When I was like 8 or so years old, I was looking around in the classroom at school and wondered what all the girls thought about it. After all, a lot of them are probably going to give birth some day - aren't they anxious, scared, terrified?
Also, why is there then no similar pain for us guys? Seems very unfair to me.
Oh, and also, are animals in pain too when they give birth?
Birth is far more painful
Birth is far more painful for humans than it is for most other animals. This is because of the combination of narrow hips and large skulls. We need narrow hips to walk upright efficiently, and large skulls to house our large brains. However, it makes it hard to fit one through the other.
Child birth is not painful;
Child birth is not painful; we make it that way: -
http://www.arizonachoices.com/journal/AZCHDec_web.pdf
(See page 3)
Just because we make birth
Just because we make birth more painful than it has to be, and some people have painless births, does not mean that birth is not usually painful to some extent. I agree however, that it need not be feared or regarded as an overwhelmingly unpleasant experience. Then again, I have never given birth, so it's best not to talk like I know everything about it
But WHY is it usually
But WHY is it usually painful?
One needs to make a connection between the psychological state that is enforced in culture; as well as the stress hormones that are increased after the sexual relationship that gives rise to the birth. It is also our modern attitudes that make us divorced from our bodies and our spirituality.
Also; ever wondered why 70%+
Also; ever wondered why 70%+ women have ruined skin after birth and hate their bodies?
Well, chances are its down to stress hormones: -
http://www.all-about-everything.com/steroid-hormones-and-stretch-marks-t...
Birthing Orgasm!
I was so warmly pleased to read that article. I have two sons, both born at home,to different women. I was there to catch the babies. I think that there is a great deal of truth in the article. Those births were peak life experiences for me. Both were ecstatic experiences. It is important to make a place for ecstacy at birth. As in life. for the mother, it is very important to have made her peace with ecstacy. There is a lot of both commitment and surrender in consiously moving toward ecstacy. Ecstacy is a Primal Action of Being. I get a sense of both movenent and a concentrated stillness of presence as I move in devine joy. I enter a plane where I am aware of the connectedness of many things. Synergy starts to cook! It seems that I am guided, or that I know what to do in the next split second. This is how to have an easy birth. Be filled with trust and faith,then act in the way that you percieve in that moment to be right for this next second. It becomes a great dancing, rejoicing, heavenly flow. Dancing with the child within . Welcoming the child to come out. It seems that we are introduced to ecstacy through orgasm. My experience has been that by courting it with commitment and surrender ,in a mode of freedom of self expression,you can have this profound experience. And it can happen outside of sex. The truth is resoundingly evident. As in "I love" or "My baby IS" or "These are the colors"or "this is the shape of my dreambody as I dance". So the valley orgasm. An orgasm of integrating connectdness? And there is a place for pain in the wholeness of truth. Ecstatic pain. Strong in it's truth.Alloyed with joy. Profoundly liberating! At birth and at death (and in between). A very concentrated 'I am here now!" YES!
Use of the word 'orgasm' is not helpful
I think its dangerous really, to use the word 'orgasm' and apply it to birth. Even amongst those women having natural childbirth; 'orgasm' is an infrequently reported phenomenon and usually brought upon by prior stimulation or excitation. Most women who have natural home-births report slight pain in the periods before labour; but through meditation and right attitude prevent it from making their body produce large amount of stress hormones. Labour then becomes an experience of 'elation' if the mindset and environment is right; and they become a vessel for the womb to give birth with pain being outweighed by a surge in oxytocin.
This woman is not experiencing an orgasm; and I believe its the right approach to avoid those chemical highs and lows: -
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=dZJE-3BvlF0
There WILL be some pain and some testing times before and during labour; but with the right attitude one feels elation and a feeling of empowerment flow through your being like a river.
Painful...
I think it must be painful for those women who are not prepared for it. I've seen a range of reaction to the process. It's such a different experience for each woman! It is an epic event in anyone's life. There are rites of initiation for events like this, some women of our generation are learning them again. It is a risky venture, to be sure, but also a cosmic one. -G
Unnh. . .It seems to me that
Unnh. . .It seems to me that the word orgasm ,like many other words,is a bit of a catch all for a range of experiences. Some events alter the range of our perception. Thereby affecting the world we experience. Orgasm is such an event. I am finding that my involvement on this site is expanding my awareness of what orgasm may be. I find it interesting . Your view of the possible perceptions of orgasm ,being dangerous for mothers to attach, to their understanding of birth, should overshadow your willingness to recieve what they have written. Authority is of little use in approaching the unknown. And afterall, we are blokes.
P.S. Annihlate the neurochemical processes in your mind and you'll be a walking zombie. The story written by the woman who had an orgasm like birth experience and then reports feeling extra great for months. Didn't that sound like a possibly beneficial neurochemical mix to you ? If you set reactiveness to the big O word aside?
Just to muddy the water
an earlier visitor reported to me (privately) that his wife got pregnant constantly, and produced 5 children they couldn't begin to afford...over his objection (he didn't know about karezza
) BECAUSE she felt so good on those pregnancy hormones. They ease stress and depression, 'tis true.
Yet it's a temporary neurochemical search for relief...not unlike using porn in some ways. I can't help thinking that there has to be a sustainable solution to neurochemical balance, and that we had better master it, on this way-over-crowded, toxic planet. Or we'll go right off the cliff like a herd of lemmings...just trying to "feel better" by the ways biology seduces us to.
Marnia, I'm curious about
Marnia, I'm curious about pregnancy hormones now. What is the research you've read about hormones involved in pregnancy? I know I have watched many friends go through many stages of stress and depression related to their pregnancies and throughout, especially if it happened at an unwanted time, they are not getting along with their partner, or they are overwhelmed already raising a small child with very little help from their partners. To the contrary, pregnancy can be and is very stressful for many women. Their bodies are changing, they're gaining weight, they may feel overwhelmed by their partner's needs for sex while they are still pregnant. This probably isn't the experience for every woman, but it seems misleading to sugggest that pregnancy reduces stress and depression for most women because of the hormones involved.
I think of this stuff in terms of archetypes. There are women who identify with Demeter, the mother archetype, much more strongly than others, and Demeters are not by any means in the majority. Some women simply gain most of their fulfillment and self-definition through their role as mothers. I'm not saying there's no neurochemical counterpart to this, but I find it just as likely that such women might be getting high off of the great feelings of bonding and oxytocin from suckling and raising the children as they do from being pregnant. Is there an addictive component to oxytocin?
Hmmmm....
It's my understanding that during pregnancy extra prolactin generally helps keep mothers calmer than usual...all things being equal. For example, it has been noticed that pregnant and nursing mothers seem that way when hiding in bomb shelters, etc. Prolactin also seems to be a reason their libido can drop. (Prolactin does many jobs, one of which is sexual satiation, as you know.)
As you point out, breast feeding is a high-oxytocin event, which would also make it soothing.
I don't think of either oxytocin or prolactin as "addictive." Dopamine has addictive potential because it "down regulates" when it goes too high - leaving the person who has overstimulated himself/herself feeling a temporary sense of anxiety or irritability, due to low dopamine (or decreased sensitivity to it). Oxytocin does the opposite. Not sure about prolactin. I'll see if Gary has something to share on this.
Thanks for pointing out that pregnancy can also be stressful.
Pregnancy is not innately
Pregnancy is not innately stressful, but it has become so due to socio-cultural factors that play a large part in exarcebating the chemical and physical changes already taking place. Most of the stress is, of course in the latter months of pregnancy and during labour itself...although postpartum usually offers an oxytocin high - some women suffer from depression which suggests overly high production of stress hormones during and before labour. There is evidence that imbalanced high levels of prolactin contributes to depression and anxiety in both genders.