Day 317 - What's right or wrong?

Submitted by Cassius on
Printer-friendly version

Well, I was at a good, long streak of abstinence from MO again but yesterday, at day 54, I messed up.

I didn't want to but once I started touching myself, doing this touch-rewiring-program, and realized that I wasn't getting hard, I started to edge, stopped, couldn't find sleep, started to M again half an hour later and puff, all self discipline gone with the wind. Another orgasmn with a near limp dick, hooray.

The whole thing was triggered buy my thinking, that I might still be cured by learning and wiring to a normal masturbation method. Every time I MO'd during the last half year, my thinking about this possibility is driving me nearly mad. Could it be so easy? Just masturbate every day, normally and in two months I'm cured? No more TMS cravings?

And then my addicted brain says, yeah dude, go for it, you know you want it, it feels so good. This time you can do it. It's always the same.

Today of cause, I'm a little bit more realistic. I'm still an addict, still have the everyday urge to masturbate TMS-Style and I still have zero libido.

And it might well have affected me that the girl I wanted to see last saturday actually cancelled our date in the very last minute on friday evening. Because she's got her period. Yeah, sure. I told her that I'm a little disappointed and we agreed that she will call me yesterday or today but until now, she didn't call. And I knew it. I knew it on Friday and I knew, that she wouldn't call me again. Great stuff, dating is sooo much fun. I'm not even able to get myself a cuddle buddy.

So now, what do I do? Is it wrong to relearn masturbating? Is is right to go forth with abstinence from MO?

I mean, abstinence means, that in a period of a month, I might have 5 good days out of 30. Another 5-10 that are okay, speaking of cravings and depression. And at least half a month is always a living hell, cravings and depression till I'am constantly thinking of suicide. I have done so much stuff to raise my dopamine with natural rewarding activities but it simply isn't working. It's never enough. No amount of sports, being social, time in nature, fishing, flirting is enough.

And relearning masturbation means that I'm having orgasmns every day for at least a period of a month. I think this will provoke a total relapse with TMS for sure. In fact, I know it WILL happen, because I know how I feel after having only a few orgasmns in a few days span.

And yes, I will try to date and yes I will try to get myself a cuddle buddy but damn it's not so easy if every girls always dumps me after one date. And I don't even know why. I'm funny, I'm slim and fit and I'm not bad looking either.

So what are my options here? Going on? Starting again with abstinence? I fear I don't have the strength to do so much longer. I'm as far from cured as one could be. Sad truth it is.

So I think I am at a point, where I can take this no longer without serious, professional help. I'm not even totally depressed today or having a crazy chaser, this is more likely to happen during the next days.

And today, it's not my depression speaking for me, in fact, I seem to see a lot clearer than I did in quite a while. All what I'm writing are my experiences from the last year of rebooting. I don't see myself getting anywhere and If I'm totally honest, nothing, absolutely nothing has changed during more than one year of rebooting.

Uff, I think thats it for today.

Cassius out.



I don't think thats a great idea. I think your best bet is to leave pmo alone completely. besides bro fuck learning how to masturbate properly. instead learn to engage women and get laid. Just my two cents. Best wishes!


It's always upsetting to feel rejected

But try not to take it personally or be discouraged for long. It happens to everyone. You'll survive.

Here's a story you might like. It just showed up under our recent PT post

Young Porn Users Need Longer To Recover Their Mojo

His comment:

This hits home, and my story backs this up.

I was exposed to porn at 8, was into hardcore porn by age 12, continued to escalate through high school and college, over the years my porn taste changed to stuff I once wasn't into, I ended up just searching for something shocking rather than beautiful girls. As time passed my sex drive in real life decreased and my drive for porn increased. Then it got to the point where I could no longer get turned on by real girls, i had a beautiful girl who I was extremely attracted to, and I felt nothing.
After I found out porn was the cause I couldn't believe it so I tried to masturbate to my imagination (something that I hadn't done since I was 15. And I could NOT get an erection now matter what I thought about and how hard I used my hand, no life in my junk. Then I thought I was broken so I went and turned on porn and BAM I got an erection, as soon as I looked away from the screen it went away.
I quit porn cold turkey at that moment.
I thought it was going to take me 6 or 8 weeks, oh how wrong I was...
A month went by then withdrawal hit me hard. I had extreme headaches, insomnia, anxiety went through the roof and I couldn't focus on anything. Then went into a stage for around 6 months where I felt no sexual desire at all. It took me 8 months of no porn and no masturbation to be able to get an erection to a real girl.. 500 days later and I'm now recovered and happier than ever.
Some key points to make is I had a healthy diet, great physical shape, stress free life, not nervouse around girls, beautiful girls couldn't excite me, Testosterone levels were good, and I had ED. Then the only thing that changed is I quit porn and masturbation. Over time my morning wood came back, and finally my ED went away.
I have started public speaking to teens about this as I can't stand the fact that kids have no clue what they are doing to their brains, and already I've talked to MANY teenagers who have porn induced ED, young kids now have "smart phones" and laptops and they and their parents have NO CLUE how dangerous that is.
Keep up the good work Gary and Marnia, and to anyone who thinks they can't recover I thought the same thing, but this is reversible and you CAN heal, for you younger guys just BE PATIENT and STAY BUSY doing other healthy activities.
Much Love


6 years of ED

After reading your story I thought about telling you mine
I'm 23 year old and have been addicted to prone masturbation since I was 12
At the age of 18 the first attempt to have sex failed
I noticed that i suffer from erectile dysfunction
I have been to over 6 urologists and done all check ups and my body is completely fine
I have tried many treatments including Cialis for 3 month period and had no change I still have ED
When I read healthy strokes I did not believe that prone masturbation was my problem
The longest time that I had with out masturbating was 20 days
I never had a full erection at all, I don't even know what it feels like but I remember having them when I was young.
I'm planning to stop masturbating for 2 months but after reading your story I thought nothing will change for me too? What do u think? Should I go through it ?
I really think that our condition should be studied and we should get help from professionals

Thank you for sharing your problem and hope we can help each other out

Hey man, I understand what

Hey man, I understand what you are feeling, believe me, I do.

I can't and won't tell you what to do to get cured of ED but if I could choose again, I would try the to rewire yourself to normal masturbation. And after that, you could still to cut all masturbation out of your life. But that my friend is a hard thing to do.

I didn't start with the so in the beginning of my recovery-journey and now, if I only masturbate once, I feel overwhelmed with the cravings for TMS again. These cravings have NOT diminished over time, as it seems to work for most of the porn guys. They simply won't leave me and it doesn't matter, what I do. Theres no socialising or flirting in all the world, that would cure me of these cravings. There has to be done more and more and more.

But you can only do one thing at a time, you can tell yourself, your're going through the reboot thing and after that, you wire youself to sex with girls, or, you try to unwire the whole TMS-thing by learning to masturbate normally and by doing so, you might rewire yourself to the normal feeling of orgasms and pleasure without pressure on your penis.

I don't know what is right or what is wrong and as Marnia says, our brains are plastic or so, I guess.

But before you try the endless suffering of rebooting, you might think about giving the a try. You will suffer anyways because you're addicted as you say. But a lot of guys who did the whole program seems to get cured by it and who knows why? Are those guys addicts like you and myself? Who knows? Still a lot of them seem to become cured by simply learning another, more normal approach for masturbation.

And I only want to add one more thing and that is that in more than one year of reuniting, not one guy here who used to masturbate TMS-Style told me that he was cured by abstaining and rewiring. Not a single one and there were quite a few.

And: I still beliebe that my ED is primarily caused by the changes in my brain, which might be similar to those, heavy porn users have. But the cure simply isn't the same.

And to Marnia, I might get me this book, youre telling about but to be honest, my tired little brain is so stuffed out with this and that and what might help and what not and over the long run, there comes a point where one don't want to constantly feed oneself with new information, that MIGHT help. So far, nothing did. And it doesn't matter who far you think that I am, because I know, how I felt last year and I know, how I am feeling today. And I know that I'm not even close to overcome this addiction.

Still trying to move on, still trying to get dates and to find myself a cuddlebuddy but none of these things are as easy to do and they're all very frustrating if one is constantly trying and not one girl wants to do stuff like that.

Brains are plastic guys

Have both of you read The Brain That Changes Itself?

Yes, you trained your brains to a type of sexual behavior you don't want now...but you can retrain it.

Think about how your ancestors trained for sex. During adolescence they started flirting with real partners. This is an important part of rewiring, too. If you missed that training, for whatever reason, it's going to feel awkward to deal with it now, but do it. Think of it as learning a new language. See this article for tips: The Lazy Way to Stay in Love

Explanation of addiction

To explain my addiction I thought I should tell u these points:
1- I can't sleep unless im in the prone position and thinking of sex
2- I isolate my self from the outside world in my bed so I can do the prone position

Once I took 20mg Cialis and had a 75% erection, my girlfriend back then gave me a BJ which unfortunately I did not feel anything and there was no sensation and I did not ejaculate.

From the age of 12 to the age of 17 I used to do the prone position and ejaculate while I'm doing it. At the age of 18 I start of with prone position to get in the mood and get an semi erection then use my hand to ejaculate. And I've been doing it this way past 6 years.

I have read about ED a lot and read about TMS too. I also had tried every medication available, in conclusion I relized my problem is in my mind and this addiction I have.

So I'm going to start my rebooting this way
1st month no masturbation or porn and not thinking about sex
2nd month I'll start using a herb called gentaplex and if I have hard erections I will mastubate once a week
3rd month if nothing has changed I'll start using Cialis 5 mg daily with absence of masturbation
4th month if no change I guess I'm out of options but I'll never think of having a penile implant

I too have never found anyone that has stopped TMS and cured there ED problem but I have hope to figure a solution.
I'm going to arrange a meeting with a sexologist and see if they have any advice for me, I believe that we have a fetish addiction.
Dear Cassius I will inform u of any news I get that might help us
Plz keep this blog going as it can help us with our suffering



if you go with rebooting, then start easy and don't beat yourself up, once you relapsed. It happens. Or if you're of a really strong mind, maybe it won't.

Start to abstain from MO any your Fantasy and look, how long you can go. Don't think of the 2nd, 3rd or even 4th month. Once you get to 30 days, look how you feel and go on. Maybe you're one of the lucky guys and you're seeing big results at that time.

I will keep this blog going, at least until I did the full 365 days without it. At that point, I have no idea what I do.

Thanks Cassius

I appreciate your honesty. We've long had a link to Healthy Strokes on the YBOP page for prone maturbation:

I'm not sure you're right that no one recovers from prone. What about this guy's story:

That said, I'm happy to revise the YBOP page further based on what you guys discover. If Healthy Strokes gets better results, then I'm all for that approach to rewiring.

It's not easy to change a deeply ingrained habit that is so...rewarding. The earlier it's acquired, the tougher it is to change. I feel for you guys, and I'll be anxious to hear what works.

Started my first day

Ill go through your advice Cassius thanx
Marnia I never read those blogs so thanx they gave me hope.

I have some questions ?
During the reboot should I stop touching downstairs?
If I could masturbate by my hands should I go for it?

Cassius u will be ok believe me, but I think u should consider taking natural herbs that can increase the blood flow to ur penis. Maybe it will help.

I don't think there are clear answers to your questions

During the reboot should I stop touching downstairs?
If I could masturbate by my hands should I go for it?

It seems as though you have a 4-month strategy outlined. Maybe just go with it, and wait till the second month to masturbate. I'm not sure if touching makes much difference, other than increasing chance for relapsing into porn.

But my question to you - I see no mention of porn. Did you use porn? Our advice is based on porn addiction, but who knows - it might be helpful for TMS...or not.

Hey Cassius and DavidQ8, I

Hey Cassius and DavidQ8, I haven't been on here for a while but I thought I'd let you know that I am cured and I too masturbated prone since I was young, 36 now. Read Doidge's book, it's a great primer for neuroplasticity. You may not like this but I have no idea how many days it took to get myself cured. I took Gary's advice a while back and decided to not count the days. If you want to use "days" as a measuring stick, great. For me, just stopping all masturbation completely and looking at female images online did the trick, plus exercise and meditation. TMS is a bitch, I think it may make it more difficult to recover that for others but it can be done. I haven't had any ED issues in long while now. Good luck guys.

Dude are you serious?

Dude are you serious?

Look at my account, look at all the time that I did not masturbate at all. I've nearly eleven months under the bell with absolutely minimum masturbation and never ever did I do it prone again. I doubt if i masturbated like 15 times in the last eleven months.

I'm NOT cured. I'm not having morning erections and I'm NEVER aroused by anything. The only thing I'm still craving so much is my old masturbation habit.

And to be more precise, yesterday and today were so hard to not relapse. Cravings like the ultimate chaser after relapsing and binging with prone masturbation. And I didn't do anything to trigger this. It simply hits me again and again and again. Two weeks more or less okay, cravings managable and BOOM here we go again.

I'm speechless right know. And I just want to cry.

But I'm also a little bit happy for you even if my feeling, that I can't be cured is overwhelming right know.

And please, please write more about what might have cured you and what not, PM me if you must, but please share your experience with us.


Nice to hear that ur cured.
I guess both myself and Cassius would like u to tell us more about ur experience and be kind of specific as it can benefit us very much.
I agree with Cassius about the hard cravings and I can imagine what it feels like.
I actually just relized that i truly cant sleep with out having a fantasy in the prone position for a while.

Just keep hanging on Cassius and don't lose hope.