Many Issues in my relationship, but quit porn.

Submitted by orangeram on
Printer-friendly version

Hello.I hope this isn't a problem but I wasn't sure in which category my post will fit into, as it crosses multiple topics.

A bit about me :
So I've been an observer for about a year, ever since I decided to quit porn. I'm a 21 year old male by the way. I quit on Nov 1, 2013, with only < 5 instances where i watched porn in that time. When I quit, I had just started a relationship with a woman about a month before, this relationship is still going on today. Here's issues that I'm facing that i really would like some input in :

1. Premature ejaculation, especially during intercourse hasn't gotten any better since we first started dating. I literally ejaculate upon touching her vagina. I've mostly gotten more sensitive, more likely to get an erection, and more likely to ejaculate
2. My partner isn't very sold on karezza and the passion cycle, particularly when it comes to her. She sees how ejaculating affects me for two weeks, but she claims that orgasms don't have an effect on her.If she's buying into karezza, it's because she's realizing how forced it feels to orgasm from oral sex, and how it just doesn't last long after that.
3. I still just can't help but check out other women all the time. Don't know if it's my fault or the women's fault for wearing very suggestive clothing. Whenever a woman passes by me, I especially can't help but look at her rear. For a while while I was quitting porn, I basically turned my gaze away from women completely. But nowadays I can't help but just look and salivate. As our relationship has been falling apart, and i'm just feeling down a lot, I've even started looking at models on Instagram.
4. We don't have a private space for sex. We both go to the same university and live with our respective parents. We just can't find a space on campus that would be private and secure long enough for us to undress and just cuddle, let alone have sex. Because of this, we rarely have sex these days, just kissing and caressing with clothes on isn't doing it for us anymore. It just teases us, even when we do it in the calmest way possible. We're both frustrated. It feels like the relationship is faltering.

I've read both Cupid's Poisoned Arrow and Tantric Sex for Men which have helped me understand a lot of what's going on. It's difficult to do the techniques and ideas that are mentioned in those books when my partner doesn't buy into it. I've shared the books with her, and when I thought a book might be too much, I shared posts from this website. We've watched Slow Sex too by Diana Richardson. She hasn't read the books, only a few sections when I basically urged her to read them. I've even suggested Tantric Orgasm for Women

Any suggestions ? I really need other people's input. Doing this alone with my partner has been very very difficult. Nowadays I'm even considering finding another partner.

If you've gotten this far, Thanks a lot for reading my post. It's much appreciated.

Thanks for your response

Thanks for your response Marnia. It's much appreciated. I'll pass that link onto her once we start talking again. We decided to take a break from each other and focus on ourselves.

Say we were able to find a relaxed space to connect, what's would you suggest to be the next step?.

Due to my problem with

Due to my problem with premature ejaculation, we haven't been able to engage in either vigorous or slow sex( karezza). I ejaculate pretty much upon being an inch inside her :(. I've practiced breathing techniques to relax my entire body, especially the pelvic floor, tried to scissors position too, tried various kegel exercises. It feels inevitable that I have to go through a 2 week cycle every time we have intercourse. And if we plan to engage in slow intercourse every day then that feels like I'm putting myself deeper and deeper into the passion cycle. It's quite discouraging. At many points I've considered quitting any type of intercourse just to avoid that really moody and uncontrollable 2 week cycle.

What can I do? I know it's tough to help out but maybe I've been researching the wrong things. Any tips would help. Thanks a lot.

You're not actually relaxed

You're not actually relaxed enough if that happens. When that happens, at least part of you is going, OMG, OMG, this is so awesome and then, oops!

[quote=orangeram]Doing this alone with my partner has been very very difficult. Nowadays I'm even considering finding another partner. [/quote]

That's a high quality problem you have, "I need a partner who's less attractive so I can stop PEing"...  lol

Try going in VERY slow...  In stages, go in a little, then stop and take a few deep breaths, then a little more, and when all the way in, do nothing for a minute or two. The key to long and slow sex is starting slowly

You may want to practice on your own, but only do this if you're at a level where you can gently and slowly stimulate yourself without fantasizing and can avoid ejaculation, focusing on pleasure only and keeping things cool. The idea is to pay real attention to when you first feel that feeling like fluid is moving that makes you want to ejaculate and stop and cool down. While you're stopped you can do the taoist big draw until you no longer feel the pressure. Your penis may go slightly limp or more, but thats ok, this is actually the key to marathon sex. Once you learn to stop when you reach that point, you will no longer get too close to the edge.

Another option would be to go ahead and ejaculate, then cuddle or hang out for a while. do something relaxing with her, watch a funny show or something and 20-30 min later when the time is right, then practice slow sex. You don't have to do it the perfect right way when you're practicing and learning how to do it.

First of all, thanks a lot

First of all, thanks a lot for taking the time to reply to my post. It's much appreciated !

Yea I think a part of me is still going "OMG, this is so awesome" but I haven't been able to get rid of it. I've been working on meditating and deep breathing whenever I can, but I feel like it all going out the window when it comes to being intimate.

From the times that I've tried going in slow, I've always ended up ejaculating just about an inch inside. It's annoying because I don't feel much pleasure at all from the head of my penis during any activity, it's the least sensitive of my genitals. So It's difficult to focus on pleasure when there really is none. All I feel is anxiety and just an overwhelming uncomfortable feeling.

To answer your question about the condom that you replied to in a different comment. Whenever I've allowed my penis to go limp in a male condom, I feel that when it grows back into the condom, it's in it differently and I'm afraid that it might rip the condom and end up risking pregnancy. How do you guys do this ? I'm guessing you use birth control pills ? This is why I want to test female condoms. But the one time we used a female condom, we ended up using it wrong and had to purchase a Plan B pill and it made my gf feel like crap.

Several thoughts

If the PE problem is due to too much friction, try some lube. Try some thin stuff, like Silk E, or some thick stuff, like KY Jelly. Or a combination. See what works best. For a while I used thick stuff on the head, and thinner stuff on the shaft of my penis.

As Cade says, go in SLOWLY. If an inch is too much, just go in half an inch and stop until you're sure it's safe to continue, then go in a little more, and so on. Once you're all the way in, you'll probably be OK, at least that's my experience.

If you lose your erection during the process, don't panic. You can use your hand (or maybe her hand?) to push it in. That's what Diane Richardson calls "soft entry."

If you feel yourself starting to come, pull out IMMEDIATELY. It might save you from coming. And if you do start to come, don't "help it along." Try to minimize the intensity of the orgasm and amount of ejaculation by relaxing and not moving at all.

If you do come inside her, just stay connected and cuddle for half an hour. At least you'll get some oxytocin, which might mitigate some of the other fallout from orgasm. Or connect again a while later, whenever you can get it up again. The second time, you should be a lot less likely to have a UE (unwanted ejaculation Smile ).

Thanks a lot also for

Thanks a lot also for replying to my post. Much appreciated !

I've only tried the lube that I've been able to get for free, it's thin though so maybe I'll look into thick lube. It sounds like a good idea to put the thick lube on the head, but like I said to Cade, I don't have much sensitivity in the head in the first place. I think a lot of it is anxiety which I'm having trouble calming down probably due to 1. fear of pregnancy 2. fear of the cycle which puts my through mood swings . 3. Can't find a comfortable place or sex position that I can really relax in.

What I always wonder when i go through threads is " does anyone fear pregnancy at all ? ". Maybe it's because I'm in university and living with a family that does not agree with sex/kids before marriage. Do people just say "screw it" or is there something I'm missing ?

Any recommendations on positions ?

I'm hoping you and cade's tips would help. I guess I first need to figure out how to deal with my anxieties.

We can give that a shot. The

We can give that a shot. The main issue there is condoms as she's not on birth control. Going to have to figure out how to reconnect while insuring pregnancy doesn't happen. We've been thinking about female condoms. Any idea if those would help?

What's wrong with male

What's wrong with male condoms, they're cheaper and easier to find.

Also, wearing one can reduce anxiety about that issue, making it easier to not pre-ejaculate.

Oh, and they lower your sensitivity.

Currently, me and my gf have

Currently, me and my gf have decided to focus the next while on just fixing the intimate part of our relationship, nothing else, so we don't spread our efforts too thin. The thing is, she's still not agreeing that orgasms are having an effect on her and kind of thinks that I'm blaming all my behaviour on the orgasm and not taking control of them, even though I'm trying my best to control them.

So I've given in and I'm doing what she wants - giving her oral sex , spankings, being rough with her, talking dirty, and allowing her to give me oral sex. She's not finding any fall out from that with her body, but it's exhausting me. I don't think she's really listening to her body, but she doesn't agree. Does anyone have any experience with a similar situation ? Right now I'm just doing what she wants and I'm hoping that at some time the orgasms hit her and she notices something with herself.

I don't think she will notice it

My wife didn't notice it either; not until she gave up orgasms for a while. Now she is like a different person. She's A LOT more relaxed, more resilient, more patient, less tired, doesn't anger easily, and is just generally more happy. She's done the experiment enough times now to actually pinpoint orgasm as the cause of her anxiety/impatience/quick temper issues.

It's not just quitting the orgasms though. It has to be combined with a daily supply of lots of generous bonding; cuddling, touching, massaging, eye gazing, gentle intercourse, etc. Without that, we don't really feel the benefits of skipping orgasm as much and can still become frustrated and edgy with each other.

Your gf won't notice the fallout until she experiences not having it. Seriously, it would be like if you had pink tinted glasses on since birth (but you didn't know it), and one day someone tries to explain to you that you that the world isn't tinted pink - it's just that you have tinted glasses on and you should remove them. You wouldn't understand what they were talking about until you removed the glasses.

That's a great analogy with

That's a great analogy with the tinted glasses. Thanks for sharing that and your story with your wife.

In the past couple months, I haven't given my girlfriend a lot of orgasms. Maybe 1 a month, so I think that's one of the reasons why she can't pinpoint orgasms as the cause of her negative behaviour.

I think that around the first time that I introduced the orgasm cycle to her, she mentioned that she used to get into a lot of arguments and fights with her ex, and that they used to have a lot of sex. That was I believe the closest she's ever got to believing that orgasms might have had an effect on her. But she also says that she was a different person during that time, younger and less mature, which could have played a role in how that relationship turned out.

Starting this week, what I guess I'm aiming to do now is to give her a lot of orgasms for a couple weeks, and hope that she notices a difference in herself. As it's final exams for the next two weeks for our university semester though, I feel that whatever frustration/anxiety/anger issues she gets, she'll blame on the exams and not on the orgasm. We've been having a lot more arguments lately, especially around the question of whether we should continue our relationship or not. Whenever we talk about commitment, she says she's committed, but I don't see the effort. She's open but closed at the same time :/.

Update: not as planned

So I waited till after exams. Our arguments got bad but she realized that she needed to put more effort in her side and she browsed reuniting and found the post on the 4 steps to karezza. We decided to do the genital massages 3 days a week, decided on which days they'll happen too. We started a few days before news years and had 2 sessions. They felt fantastic. The problem is that since the beginning of the month she's only actually given me the massages 3 times and I think two of them were after I asked for them. She said that she enjoyed doing them for me. But for the last two weeks we haven't done anything more than hug and kiss a bit and it's really frustrating me. She's just so stubborn and really dislikes planning these kind of things. It doesn't matter if I show her other people's experiences. She doesn't open up the topic unless I do, avoids it. All her attention is on studying. Last priority seems to be intimate time for us.

Am I being needy or am I reasonable. After everything I feel like I'm being reasonable, but I'd appreciate your thoughts on the matter. I really don't know what to do. I've taken up meditation every morning, been at 20 minutes every day for the last month and it's helped a lot with my awareness and focus. I'm trying to be as aware and relaxed and calm as possible but this missing intimacy in our relationship is eating away at me. Almost every time I bring it up to her, she'll get down and say she messed up, and same excuses. Now we're talking on the phone and she's basically given up, telling me that she's tired of disappointing me. I don't know what's next

Honestly, it sounds to me

Honestly, it sounds to me like you're being a little pushy, even if you're not intending to be. Personally, it works best for me if I take the attitude that if she wants sex(or karezza/or making out/anything sexual) she will make it happen. That way, if I try to kiss or touch and I don't get a reciprocal response, I'm not going to keep overtly trying to please her trying to get something back and I just switch to doing my own thing, meaning my response might be something like, "Ok, I'm going to sleep then..." "I'm going for a walk" or just generally focusing on yourself in a way where you don't worry about yoiu and her and just do your own thing. Of course, it's also important to know when she wants you to break through her resistance(and I guarantee you there are times she does, if she really likes you)

It seems she is frustrated and trying something new and feels she is disappointing you(I get the sense she feels bad about this), so don't keep bringing it up, at least for a while. Also, she probably doesn't like planning things because she wants anything sexual to be passionate and spontaneous(some of us are like that!)

Other than that, it's up to you to figure out a way for things to work, or give her space to figure out her end. I could be wrong, but I honestly think it's easier for a man to introduce karezza through non ejaculatory sex than it is for a woman to try and get a man to learn non orgasmic sex, partly bc I think we have less control over our orgasms. Ultimately we men still have to learn to control it.

But I really think from your story, your best option might be to have sex and you'll probably PE, that's ok,. go for round 2 with more control and last longer; if you can, do non ejaculatory sex and just keep working on it until you get it. Basically introduce karezza more and more. What I mean is stop trying to have a perfect karezza experience everytime and just try to relax and enjoy and focus on the pleasure and experience of it. You'll get it if you keep working at it. You're 21? and she's probably close to your age, so you two probably have less to worry than some of us about wasting sexual energy.

And you're relatively young to be taking this path...

I'm sorry that this is long,

I'm sorry that this is long, I didn't think that my reply would be this long. A lot has been on my mind the last 2 days.

We talked and what I ended up understanding is that although she's open to trying new things, to try karezza, her best sexual experiences were conventional orgasmic sex with her exes. So basically until karezza provides her with a better experience than conventional sex, she wants to stick with conventional sex. This is what I've pretty much always thought, she just wouldn't admit it. She also told me that she just wants to feel wanted, that she wants to feel pleasure. She wants it a lot that when we get the chance to be a bit intimate, she can't help but go to her default and seek out pleasure from conventional sexual acts. To me, it feels like eventually she's going to get fed up with my PE and will seek out someone else. She disagrees, but I can't see her going through her life without sex.

Whenever I try lazy ways of being in love like gentle kisses on the lips and gently slow licks and kisses of her breasts, she told me that it only feels good to her when I'm going fast. She'll start kissing me fast. I feel that everytime I take a deep breath and cool things down, slow down the kisses and relax, she hates it and feels like I'm denying her pleasure. She doesn't admit to it, I'm guessing because she doesn't want to hurt me.

Besides that we agreed to try the massages again, we did that the last 2 days. I ended up with minor ejaculations both times ( held it in as much as I can back ). Both those days though i put in effort in giving her pleasure, mostly through kissing and licking her breasts vigorously just as she wants in( it was during those times that she told me that she just wants to feel wanted) . One of those ejaculations was because I was giving her pleasure ( the first time I ever got an ejaculation from giving someone pleasure) I felt like a child that just discovered women, it was really unexpected.

Any thoughts would be appreciated. I'm trying not to be pushy, but I feel like if I just don't do anything, we're just not going to have any intimacy in our lives at all and will likely break up. I also end up with a lot of sexual energy built up in me and those exercises on the solo experiences page just pause that feeling for a bit. I don't know how she just keeps in all that sexual energy inside her and doesn't complain.

I have 2 questions that have been on my mind a lot lately.
1. Why is it that after ejaculating, sometimes i just want nothing to do with my gf, other times, like yesterday when she continued with the massage after I ejaculated, that the massage felt 10x better ? Why the heightened senses? I've even experienced this heightened sensation of pleasure in the shower on my own after an ejaculation. The water on my body would feel 10x better.

2. How do couples have successful 20, 30, 40 year relationships with conventional orgasmic sex ? I just don't understand that.They look like teenagers that just fell in love. It really pushes me to question karezza sometimes. There are plenty of couples in their 60s that engage in orgasmic sex with their spouses frequently and they're in love. Many say that it's the key to being in love.

You can't make her

do something she doesn't want to do. Sad

I almost never escaped the cycle after climax, but you're right that it was not always as intense. And sometimes (back in the day) I remember being "high" for several days after climax...before the hangover caught up with me. Since I was quite likely to behead my partner when it hit...I ruined a lot of relationships. Blush

I think stable couples don't know what actually bonds them. They think it's the orgasms, when it's really the intercourse, companionship and touch. But our entire biology is set against our understanding karezza, so it's normal to be confused, especially if you're using orgasm moderately (such that it's easy to blame the fallout on other life events).

Also, lovers who are still in the honeymoon period are jacked up on extra neurochemicals that "hide" the effects of climax a bit because they tend to be obsessed with one another. Will Orgasms Keep You in Love?

It's getting harder for both women and men (younger) to find pleasure in sustainable (gentle) lovemaking because they are so used to overstimulation with sextoys and superstimulating porn that they aren't sensitive to "normal" pleasure. The only way out that I can see is to let them slam into the wall repeatedly...until they get tired of it and want something different.

I wish I had a more encouraging answer, but as long as she values her orgasms above her relationship, I see wall after wall in her future. I hope I'm wrong. Maybe get her to read my book. Or ask her to try a month of karezza followed by a month of her way. But no cheating with side orgasms. Acute


I've had that same "high" you

I've had that same "high" you're talking about, sometimes it doesn't hit me fully until about 4 days later ! The most annoying though are the dream ejaculations, sometimes they have an effect on me and sometimes they don't. I haven't been able to figure out when ejaculations or orgasms affect me and when they don't. It seems random but I'm sure it's not.

Being able to tell whether a life event or the orgasm which is the cause to my bad mood has been really tricky. At the end of the day I find that taking responsibility for it, either way, helps. I think too many people assume that their moods are completely not under their control when in fact they do have quite a bit of control over it.

So are you saying that the orgasms can lead to an obsession over one another if coupled with bonding, companionship and touch ?That the bonding behaviours keep couples together and kind of stop the orgasms from getting them to seek other partners ? Orgasms creating the addiction over one another ? Just trying to make connections, I hope that makes sense.

I don't see my gf as valuing orgasms above our relationship. She's basically given up sex in order to keep us together. She doesn't watch porn or masturbate. She does see how orgasms affect my mood, just doesn't see how it affects her. As she's had more sexual experience in her life than me ( she started having sex in her early-mid teens, I didn't until i was 19) I think that she has hit a couple walls so I don't think there's too many more to go :) At the moment I believe she's committed to giving the massages and she's been doing great. I'm not quite sure when to transition into intercourse though. I'm thinking maybe by the end of next week or the week after that as long as we keep the massages at 3-4x a week.

Breaking up

We got into an argument today, I think we're really going to break up. It didn't have anything to do with karezza or the massages. I don't know if it's appropriate for me to put details here, so I'm going to refrain from that until I get approval. Maybe it needs a different thread. I'm really really upset but I'm trying to stay calm. I'm basically going to have to bottle this up because I have a very important exam on Tuesday. Our relationship going away like this just doesn't feel right, not after everything we've gone through together. I'm really upset and I can't express that enough in words. Mediated a bit to calm myself down but I don't know how long that will last.
Where should I seek help, if not here? Thanks for all your help