Cannot practice Karezza but orgasms make me sick

Submitted by Deadsun on
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Hello everybody,

I'm a new member here. I'm french and I don't find things on this subject in my country. I'm reading Cupid's Poison Arrow and I came in this web site to have other points of view.
I'm 31 and I have a mate.
Since I'm 18 I think that orgams make me feel bad : exhausted during several days, no energy. Each time this happens, I regret the following day. Yet, this happens again, and the bad feelings too.
In fact, I'm not attracted by Karezza sex. Even if sometimes I love to practice sex this way, it can't be always like this. Yes sex is a spiritual sharing, it's deep, intense, it's love, it's beauty,...all this is the "white side", like if we were 2 angels reaching light and paradise. But the "dark side" of sex is so goood too ! Hard sex, pulsion, madness, bestiality, heavy breathing, scream, orgasms and ejaculation. This is these both sides of sex that make it so exceptional.
When I do not have orgasm and we practice sex in the dark way, I feel good. I does't matter if he climaxes or no. I love when this happens but it's not essential to find it was good. What I want to underline is that hard sex does not systematically involve orgasm. Like I must say sex in the "white way" can involve orgasm : I sometimes practice "Karezza" (slow moves, deep breath, no contracted muscles) and in spite of this, I have a really strong orgasm.
It's good to climax, even if I love sex without it. When we make love, the reason I climax is that I decide it to happen. During the last 7 months, I had 5 orgasms but the consequences are really terrible : 2 or 3 weeks of fatigue, depression, need for sugar or junk food. I feel so good when this do not happen... After 3 month I feel like I'm younger, I have a more beautiful body, more beautiful hair, skin,...
I have the feeling that I have to choose to deprive myself of this highest peak of pleasure. Or to have one 2 times per years. What do you think ?

Oh, you're welcome.

Oh, you're welcome.
I came here to read other stories and to find people who think more or less like me. I Don't think everybody feels these symptoms, but only very few people. My choice to avoid orgasms is a necessity, because I feel awfully bad during several days when I climax.
Exchanges, communication, to argue are good ways to find solutions. Waiting for your answers.

I think most people react this way to orgasm

but they don't abstain [consciously] for long enough to identify that as the cause.

My wife and I both still enjoy the peak experience of hot sex and orgasm. But we've been married for over 20 years, and expect to be together for another 40. Given that, we have been practicing Karezza pretty consistently for some time now. It didn't happen right away, but after months of practice, we are now finding that not only do we prefer sex this way, she actually told me the other day that sometimes she has a hard time relaxing during sex because she's afraid to get overstimulated which could lead to an orgasm!

Orgasm does affect me, but far less than it does her. For me, I'm a little down for a few days, and I become very horny and selfish; I'm mostly better after a week. For my wife, she loses her energy, and becomes really bitchy for about 2-3 weeks! She hates feeling that way, so she's chosen to avoid orgasm.

It really did take us a good many months to conduct enough experiments both ways to feel committed to the Karezza way, not out of some idea, but because we really enjoy the enhanced sensitivity during sex, increased sweetness, frequency and length of sessions, and how much better we get along outside the bedroom.

Sorry to hear about the thalessemia minor

However, I think the biggest thing holding you back is your attachment to out-of-control sex. That's biology speaking. While we're fertile, biology wants us to be a bit reckless where fertilization opportunities are concerned...because that results in more babies.

It's a bit of a trap though, because hot sex can actually numb your response to pleasure, such that you need increasing stimulation over time. And if you stop it and opt for something gentler, or non-orgasmic, sex feels "pointless" for a while.

What you don't know until you are consistent for a while, is that as you lay off the hot sex, your body and brain become more sensitive to pleasure. So "tamer" sex actually starts to feel more pleasurable.

But it's tough to make the decision to opt for tamer sex, when you can't yet fully experience your alternative.

This YOUTube talk is not about sex. It's about food, but the same part of the brain's appetite mechanism governs both, so it's worth watching. The pleasure trap: Douglas Lisle at TEDxFremont - YouTube

Karezza in my head

I totally understand your thinking and I already experiment what Dr Douglas says for food too.
The problem with sex is that even with Karezza, after 3 months avoiding orgasm, I am so sensitive that I cannot stop myself from having one, except if my mental is strong.
I think some responses are in the last part of Cupid's Poison Arrow, but don't you think that Karezza is more a mental process (a mental control) than a kind of pratice?
Maybe it's possible to appreciate both hard and gentle sex but to stay calm in the inside, to have control, to feel "powerfull" and to keep this "power", this energy? Or even to share it?
It's not to "out of control sex" that I am really attached, It's to extreme sex, but with control. Extreme means for me extremely soft and tender as it means extremely savage and heavy. And I know...I'm totally aware that heavy sex is risky, and that we are more inclined to climax.
When I keep control for month, you're right sex is much more enjoyable than before. My though is that Karezza sex is a double security and that practicing hard sex is playing with the "devil", maybe I like it, but only when I win.

Well, at least you see

your choices clearly, and that puts you ahead of most of the planet, who don't realize they are inadvertently bringing on a lot of their own misery once those honeymoon neurochemicals wear off.

In case it's of interest, a number of visitors here have mentioned that orgasms that "just happen" during gentle sex don't seem to set off the same intensity of "hangover." What has your experience been?

Frankly, it doesn't sound like you're winning at all - unless you're only taking into account the pleasure of the high part of the cycle. Biology is sneaky, eh?

I will

No I'm not winning. If I were winning I would not write the same things here. That's why I compare orgasms to evil, because they often are stongest than me, and I hate me for that. I hate this bad mood, this bad health, this weakness they make me feel. So I hate me for loosing, I hate my vulnerability, my lack of will in front of this "end of pleasure" (yes why would we wanna brutally stop making love and feeling great ?)

When I have an orgasm practicing Karezza I have the same bad consequences, and sometimes it's worse because the pleasure is so long et emotionnally strong that it could make me cry, and at this moment it's just perfect because it's supreme pleasure, supreme love and deep spiritual sharing.
Gentle or hard sex, if I lose, the only things that can prevent my symptoms is tendeness after sex, a lot of love (as you say in your book). Not easy as I have a long distance relationship and that he have symptoms too (he doesn't know that, like most people). Yes he's less communicative (typical man symptom) and I'm more needy for love (not for sex, after I orgasm I do not have any interest in sex anymore, and I don't like this feeling of being sterilised). And being needy and anxious with an emotionnally and physically distant man can be destructive for the relation.

When I win during several months, I just don't mind if my mate have symptoms, his distance cannot affect me, I'm strong, I'm a lot more attractive, I have much more sex appeal. And in fact : even if he climaxes, he doesn't really have symptoms because my self confidence, my attractiveness, my sensuality cannot leave him indifferent. It's like I can give him power, energy, like I can give him more than he need.
No I'm not winning but I will. I really don't know if I will completely stop or if I will just allow me to have these perfect 10 seconds in some perfect and exceptionnal occasions. I think I'll choose the second option, but these special time must really be worthwhile and unforgettable.

I would like to thank you for your work.
Lovers, friends did and do not really understand me. Thanks to you and your awarness, I feel a lot less alone and strange. On the contrary, I think we maybe have a sixth sense.

I'm glad the material

was comforting, even if it doesn't offer a magic pill for making your sexuality fit the standard myth that no amount of orgasmic intensity can cause fallout. It's clear that some people are more sensitive than others. What's not clear is what percentage of people would see unwanted symptoms when they actually watch for them. Right now, few people even observe themselves enough to see it.

What really matters is what happens in your personal "laboratory." As long as you know how to understand and manage your relationship with orgasm, you're in a better place. And the course of action you choose now may not be the course you choose later in life.

My guess is that when you and your partner can be together nightly, your sensitivity may even out a bit. So, be optimistic. But you may always be more sensitive to climax than most. If so, karezza is a good option to have around. And who knows? If you're consistent with slowing down, you may discover there's something even better than what you've experienced so far.

Let us know how it goes.



I just want to add that I have proof my symptoms are real, not in my head:
- After 3 months without orgasm, my hair grows 10 millimeters in 10 days
- Now (5 "O" in 7 months), my hair has grown 7 millimeters in 2 weeks
- And when I regularly climax, my hair grows max 6 or 7 millimeters each month

Thank you again.
I'll give you some news.

It's interesting that you report faster hair growth

I've seen a number of men on the pornography recovery forums (where guys often stop masturbation/ejaculation for a while as well as porn use) report "faster hair growth" (and even regrowth of areas where they had lost a lot of hair!). Clearly, there are little understood neuroendocrine changes in connection with climax.

Honestly, I think people should do as they please, but I strongly feel they should know that climax isn't the genital equivalent of blowing one's nose, at a neurochemical level. There's so much to learn here and yet we humans totally resist learning it.

Then we feel sorry for species like the poor antichinus, the males of which exhaust themselves (fatally) during a single mating season, so driven are they to copulate frenetically. "New Species Of Marsupial Has Sex Until It Dies"

The wisdom of conserving sexual energy as a general rule has resurfaced in different forms for thousands of years...but our collective memory is short - thanks to those intense feelings triggered deep in the primitive part of the brain. They are so compelling that we're sure they're a good idea regardless of subsequent costs. And that is precisely their purpose. Sexual arousal is about maximizing reproduction. It didn't evolve to increase individual wellbeing.



I screw it up


This did not happen during 3 months. BUT, this just happenned several times one night, without contact, like if it had to be like this. What do you think ?

Maybe Spring cleaning yes,

Maybe Spring cleaning yes, and maybe the lack of love (and sex) too.
It's been 2 months I cannot see my mate at all (serviceman), and I have to wait for him 2 other months.

Yes I clearly saw benefits of 3 months without it, the most important is that I need less sleep, I feel good almost all the time, and have a lot of energy.

But I have the impression that ONE orgasm was necessary because I became more nervous and too speed (too much energy ?). But I didn't stop after one, I had 4...and now I'm really tired. Maybe yes it's because I need a "chaser" after sex, that I am hornier after I orgasm, or that I need something else ? (tenderness ?)

In the link you gave me, a man says :
"Since then I have come to realize the benefits of not "going for it." If I feel the urge to cum, I just relax and let it pass. Then we are ready for more. I am really enjoying the long, slow lovemaking that seems like it never really ends."

I think that if my mate was there with me, I would have been completely satisfied after just one.

Quick question

Did you use porn? It's easier to avoid "the chaser" if you just masturbate to your own imagination (preferably realistic and familiar fantasy, or no fantasy).

It's tough to be away from your lover for long periods. Good luck.

Porn ? Not a big fan, but...

I used to watch porn regularly (every day) in the past, when I was with my ex boyfriend. The reason was that our relationship didn't work out (it was to see other men).
Since we broke up, this happens maybe 1 time a month, single or not.

Today, it's when I don't have enough news from my man, I prefer a lot more to fantasize about him, but I need dialogue, I need to feel that he is "with me", writing to me, thinking of me.
I do not find porn very attrative : it is generally so no sexual for me, it's overacted and there is a lack of real sexual tension, it's like "sanitized", and there is no powerful male. Only some amateur porn or exceptions works with me.
And I am pretty sure that when I watch these "good porn", it means unconsciously "You're not coming to say hello, you're not texting me, I watch porn". I'm not addict to porn at all. But sometimes, why not ! ? When I broke my ogasms' abstinence 3 days ago, I thought about my mate, but in the morning I concluded with amateur porn. Not proud, because I had "enough" with my night.

I'm waiting for him and I hope that he'll be the man of my life. That is what I want. But Before his mission (I don't know if it's the good term in english), we did not see each other a lot because we have a long distance relationship. I don't know him well, and his 4 months mission does not help.

sexual energy is real

And if you don't know how to live and work with it,especially when alone, it usually ends up as a waste of energy. That's why I keep recommending mantak chias books. They provide the what to do, the practices. Combined with meditation, dealing with the issues you so sincerely and honestly describe becomes doable.

I agree

Yes I realise that sexual energy is real. But don't you think it's a deal ?

My energy rise up :
When I have a good sleep (I mean just what I need and when I need)
When I eat healthy oils, not too much bad fats, good carb, enought vegetables, not too much proteins and just a little sugar
Also when I practice fasting (I gain a lot of energy)
When I don't stress and keep calm in any situation
When I practice yoga
When I agree with myself
When I don't do sex with orgasm as a goal
When I walk alone and breathe deeply, and feel the sun on my skin

So it's not just sexual energy.

When a couple make love and have a lot of energy, if they do not try to reach orgasm but that it happens because they have so much energy that they can't avoid it. Maybe that kind of orgasm do not involve a waste of energy. That is an impression. What is your thought on this?

Female orgasm

When a woman has an orgasm breathing deeply, not contracting any muscle, or just streching, For exemple, if a woman orgasms doing yoga postures and then goes on with her yoga, and that she feels just good and relaxed the following hours, and the following day, and that it happens again but she always feels great, calm. Etc.
My impression is that this kind of orgasm is completely different from those we try, hardly sometimes (need of overstimulations), to reach, with or without a partner.
If I was a man I could know if what I describe is "orgasm without ejaculation". Don't you think it's almost the same, "woman version", and that this is not harmful (doing this alone or not) ?

And I have already booked "Healing Love Through the Tao - Cultivating Female Sexual Energy" in french. I'm waiting for it. I-m so happy

it could be the same

If this sexual energy is being transformed to life and spiritual energy and circulated in your body if alone or with your partner if together. But it sounds like your orgasmic energy is going out of you into space. I don't say it's harmful but your body mind has to replenish it and you may feel this in a negative way.