Dancing with corpses

Submitted by freedom on
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During sex (karezza or more energetic sex), I occasionally go into a state which my partner describes as corpse-like. I’m not conscious of this shift, but I do notice it when she mentions it. I guess I notice the transition on the way out of the state. She feels disconnected when I enter this state. The shift is sudden as if I black out. Physically, I’m totally still in the state. At least once, I’ve not responded to a kiss by kissing as if I wasn’t aware that I was being kissed. I’ve drifted into this state for at least 20 minutes. It seems that there’s some internal disconnection or elevation to some other place. My partner wonders if I’m internally processing during these states. I report enjoying this state once I come to. That said, I don’t seem to know where I go or what is happening there, She’s pretty sure I’m not sleeping in a typical sense. If in scissors, she senses I become a dead weight.

Has anyone had similar experiences? I’m not an experienced meditator so I don’t know if there’s a connection. What about tips on how I might better access this space to figure out what is going on? Any suggestions as to how I might bring my partner into this space so that she doesn’t feel I’ve gone away to somewhere she can’t go?

What???

You're actually DOING karezza and you didn't tell us?

Congratulations!

I don't know anything about that state, but I hope you'll keep reporting. I do think people process things a lot of ways and that this gentle contact allows such processes. Whether it will fade with time, I have no idea.

:-)

Freedom, I'm so happy to hear about this (not the corpse part, but the karezza part, lol)

Where is your mind during this time? Are you focused on the present moment and aware of everything that is happening? It sounds like you are letting your mind drift to another place~~any way you can stay with your partner and not drift away?

Congratulations on your new relationship and I hope you will continue to share (hey, you owe us, ha!).

congrats Freedom!

So great to hear about your adventures. Don't have a clue about the other part of it. It sounds a little like narcolepsy...I wonder if that is possible?

Do you remain hard during this time?

I'm pretty sure it's not

I'm pretty sure it's not narcolepsy or even sleep. I'm not positive about erections, but she's noticed no significant change. We'll have to be more mindful about the details. I'll try to note the time of day as that may suggest the likelihood that it is sleep. 

Congratulations!

Hey Freedom,

Glad that you've found a partner to explore intimacy with. That's good news!

Regarding the "disconnected" state. I have lots of experience with meditation and the only thing that your state brings to my mind was a time when I was sitting at the feet of Osho listening to him talk in Poona. I had been doing a fair amount of hypnosis with the intention of deepening my meditative state and most of this was done lying down. So during the talk, I thought I'd lie down for a change and keep my forearm up to wake me if I fell asleep. I went into a deeply relaxed state and my neighbour thought I was dead. I wasn't dead at all. I was acutely aware of what was being said, but deeply relaxed. My breathing slowed to what appeared to be a stop and my body became very heavy. At the end of the talk I came out of it without any problem at all (other than a sore head from lying on a marble floor Smile )

Perhaps you are simply going into a very deeply relaxed place. That wouldn't surprise me if intimacy with a woman affects you anywhere near as powerfully as it does me. If your experience is similar to mine, it would mean that you trust your partner deeply. Not sure how your partner could participate unless she finds a way to go into a similarly deeply relaxed state. Self-hypnosis sometimes helps that process.

I hope this helps.

Sincerely,

"Arnold"

This is closer to what it

This is closer to what it seems to be to me. She recognizes that I'm deeply relaxed. There is a high level of trust. Still, my sudden disappearance into relaxation is alarming to her as she is left feeling isolated. This state has elements of my limited experience with hypnosis in that the body seems to be able to do things that make little sense when the mindbody enters certain states. Am I guiding myself there or is there some set of circumstances that send me or enable access to there? It makes sense that with stillness of mind could come stillness of body. We'll keep watching.

I'm not sure to what extent it's possible to enter each other's relaxed states. Anyone have experience with that?

Hi! :-) Glad to see you back, and with a willing partner!

My partner gets so relaxed he cannot utter a word.   It sometimes takes 10-20 minutes from him to 'come out of it' - to the point where he can talk and feels like moving again  He's aware, and can make eye contact, and he does hear me, he just can't speak.  Mostly he just lays there wearing his blissful budha face.  I do get very relaxed, and don't move, but I can always talk. 

 

Do you feel at all isolated

Do you feel at all isolated then? Or did you and you've transitioned through that? Does he know he's in that relaxed state? I have a quiet state too. My eyes are open or briefly close in that state. That's not as extreme as my sex shavasana in which my eyes are always closed. Are you able to explore your mutual states toegether?

1. I currently don't ever

1. I currently don't ever feel isolated during sex, but I may have transitioned through feeling isolated while I was still having orgasms. My ah-ha moment was realizing that the feeling of being disconnected came from inside me, from my own discomfort and goal-seeking, not from something he was doing or not doing.   My last orgasm was more than 500 days ago.  

2. Yes, he knows. 

3. His eyes are almost always closed during sex.  That's part of his buddha face.

4. The mutual state is the state we're in, we don't really do anything but experience it.   I don't feel as if we're exploring anymore - in the sense that we're no longer seeking or looking for anything to happen.  We just relax and be together. We're not going anywhere. 

At one time, I thought there was a destination, and that at some point, we'd arrive at some kind of sparkling electrical love-sex nirvana.   That's certainly how many of the books seemed to describe the goals of non-orgasmic sex, and how some others have described their Karezza experiences.  I'm no expert, though.  I suspect that each couples experience is unique. 

 

Freedom

I dont know if this applies to your situation, but often people tend to think that engaging with another sexually is about focusing on each other. I have found that the feeling inside myself and the connection with my partner is fuller when I focus on my own part in the equation. Kind of like dancing, when you concentrate on your role in the dance, rather than the other person, the overall dance is better and more fluid. I actually feel the greater self awareness one brings to the sexual interaction the deeper it goes. I primarily focus on myself with a secondary awareness on my partner. I throw this out to you as I wonder if your partner is wanting your focus on her. Of course, if you're checked out and not present with the moment and your lover, then thats a different story.

Diana Richardson explains the balance between self awareness and ones partner very nicely in her books.

I will also say that afterwards we will often disengage and lay side by side and simply feel the energy moving through our own bodies. We can can lay there silently for some time not interacting with each other at all although we are both aware of each others presence. My view is that even the experience of connection with another is still experienced within self.

My wife and I both get into

My wife and I both get into this trance-like state almost every time we have sex on our Esse. An hour could feel like ten or twenty minutes have passed. She calls it her "dreamy" state.

I would imagine if one person were experiencing this it would feel lonely, but if both are ... WOW

It's Samadhi/jhana

You're falling into a state known as samadhi, or absorption without an object, I think.

Samadhi is the Hindu word, from Patanjali's Yoga Sutra. The Buddhist word for the state is a jhana, a state of gone-beyondness.

The real challenge with such states is being sophisticated enough to return with intelligible ideas of what transpired. It's a rarified state beyond the senses, so it can only be understood in universal concepts.

Good one! You may wish to learn more about jhana from a modern teacher: google Ajahn brahm for detailed instructions on entering the 8 jhana states.