How to explain to my wife how karezza will help us?

Submitted by Montrealer on
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Hello everybody,

I am a 51 years old male in a couple and for about 6 years our sexual life is going down, and our exchanges, cuddling, intimacy is very minimal.
I really need intimate contacts to feel, well, alive!
When I read about karezza by accident, I instantly understood that it was what I was looking for for the longest time!
Now my wife is almost rejecting me on all physical contacts. What to do? I almost thought of trying to find a partner to practice karezza outside of my couple....
Please share your opinion if you think you can help!

Unlocking your wife

I think that there is a very simple place to start in a situation like yours. The first step in unlocking a woman who no longer trusts your touch is to just be with her in a way that is loving. In order to do that, you have to love yourself.

This will be be easier if the two of you still share a bed. When you are in bed together try relaxing yourself as much as possible. Then imagine that there is a cord that connects your heart to hers. Imagine that your heart fills up with love for her, and it flows down the cord from your heart to hers. While you are doing this, it helps to say in your mind what you want to be true in your marriage. For example you might say to yourself (silently) "feel loved" or "feel safe and secure". These are things that you are telling yourself to feel, however, if you are also placing part of your attention on her, then she will receive it also.

You never need the explicit cooperation of the other person in order to start healing a relationship. All that you need is a willingness to heal yourself, and to make yourself open to the other person as well. As your attitudes about yourself and your role in the marriage change, her reactions to you will also change.

I spent years trying to "fix" my wife with no success. In fact, it only made things worse. It was only when I turned my healing intentions back on myself that I made progress.

Try it, and be patient with it, and I think you will be amazed at how well it works. It sure beats begging for affection.

By the way, the affection will come back on its own. It is a product of love, not a cause of love. To focus on getting sex, getting affection or getting anything else is to focus on symptoms. It is better to focus on the real cause, which is not enough love and respect for yourself. Address THAT, and everything else will follow with little or no effort.

That sounds so good

How is that working out for you? Are you seeing any positive results in your relations with your wife? i I only ask because from what I can tell you are still stuck. Or have you turned a corner?

Not stuck

On the surface it may appear that I am stuck because we are not having sex very often. However, we are not stuck at all. We have actually made tremendous progress over the past few years.

Three years ago my wife was totally closed off. She did not like me touching her and we had frequent arguments. We did not spend much time together and I was certain we were headed for divorce.

Two years ago we were arguing much less and she was welcoming my presence and my touch.

One year ago we were at the point where if I really wanted to, I could get her into bed with some pressure. However, that did not feel satisfying so I decided to keep working on the relationship. I know where I want our marriage to be, and we are not there yet.

I know some people would read this and say "Three years!!! You have been working on this three years and she still resists being sexual! I would have given up on her long ago." People on other forums have certainly told me that. However, that is because they are too focused on sex as being the ultimate indicator of a successful marriage.

I used to think that way too. It used to be a huge source of frustration for me that my wife was sexually closed off. Somewhere along the way my focus changed. My growth became about me rather our marriage or any particular things happening in our marriage. I feel great about myself. I love myself so much now that I cannot even begin to describe the difference. From this perspective, my wife's resistance is not so much an irritation as it is a puzzle. I do not know why exactly she holds back, but it does not really bother me all that much. She is doing what she feels she has to do. I can respect that.

Meanwhile I am doing what I need to do:

I love and honor myself as much as possible. I do not allow the decisions of other people to affect how I feel about myself. In other words, the fact that she is holding back sexually does not in any way pull down my feelings about myself. That is about her, not me.

I am as honest as possible with myself. I know full well that I am not a victim here. My wife is closed off largely because I loved her in a selfish way. She has responsibility there too, but I cannot dump the full blame at her feet.

I also have complete faith in my own ability to succeed. There is no doubt in my mind that my wife will open up to me again, and it will be better than it ever was before. When will that happen? I don't know and neither does she. It will take however long it takes, but it WILL happen.

Just in case anyone thinks I am being a martyr, I will shoot down that perception right now. I am not suffering here. I am very happy in my marriage. If I was not happy I would have been gone a long time ago.

Just in case anyone thinks I have given up on sex, that is not true either. I desire to make love with my wife as much now as I ever did. The difference now is that it is a desire as opposed to a burning need. I need to give and receive love. Sex is one way that I can do that, but there are many others. There is a full spectrum of options available and I will explore them all. I have only recently discovered how awesome cuddling is. Next on the menu is long duration kisses. I am totally pumped about that one.

In other words, I am no longer driving the wheels off of the car to try and get back to sex as soon as possible. I am taking my time, enjoying the scenery and stopping at all of the interesting little shops along the road. I am enjoying the journey in all of its intricate detail rather than driving for a goal.

I suppose you could say that I am doing the entire relationship the same way I would do a karezza session. Go slow, there is no rush. Move when you need to move. Otherwise, be happy where you are. There are no goals, only new sensations to explore.

So, to answer the question directly, yes, this is working out very, very well for me.

Perfect

I love that you are letting things thaw out and become warm again on their own~~with your loving and guiding and patient presence.

As a woman who was "stuck" in a basically sexless marriage (20+ years)~~I could never imagine how things could ever go back to that passionate place we started. The longer you go without, the harder it is to change that asexual identity and return to your once sexual self. My ex-husband and I considered counseling, we gave sex some half-hearted attempts, but at the core of it, it wasn't *sex* that was lacking. It was trust and the ability to feel I could open myself back up after so many years of being closed down.

I think your wife will slowly open up and the best part is she won't be doing it intentionally~~the change will be so gradual to her it will feel absolutely *natural* and I think that is the key. She will be changing, not for you, but because she can't *not* change. And the change will be part of her and her new identity as a very sexual woman.

Keep the course, pilot! Smile

Forgiveness

Glad to hear things are going very well for you Louie and that your are not stuck, great, I admire your patience which I hope is not mistaken for complacency.
One thought, after your admission "My wife is closed off largely because I loved her in a selfish way" , have you asked her to forgive you for that and has she forgiven you?

Forgiveness

We have talked about it, but she insists that I never loved her selfishly. As far as she is concerned, our sex life is good. There is nothing obvious for her to point to and say "that is not acceptable". Instead she just feels a vague disinterest that she cannot explain.

There have also been some health issues. However, the cuddle therapy is helping with those. She is starting to relax and unwind her habitual tension.

Talking is not the way to get her on board. We have talked and talked for years. Talking just leads us in an endless loop. There is nothing further to gain from talk at this point.

Being connected and sharing time together is the thing that will break us out of the rut. That is why I am doing the cuddle therapy.

Not that simple

At the risk of sounding titchy I will reply that it is not that simple. I cannot just choose to go to that level. If it were that easy I would have been doing it already. She has to be willing to welcome me inside, and right now, she is not doing that.

She is not welcoming me, and I will not force it. Under no circumstances will I force it.

So ... I will continue the cuddle therapy and other ways of connecting until she is ready to welcome me inside.

My stance on this particular point is absolutely firm. I will NOT try to enter her until she wants me to be there. It will happen when the time is right. Until then, I wait patiently.

you're right!

of course, your job is to post that, and my job was to post what I posted LOL.

Today we got together. My wife has been extremely stressed out recently. But she initiated this. The neat thing about this, and why I mention it here, is that this type of sex is so different.

Before Karezza, her stress would have made sex out of the question, or something she caved in on with me rather than wanted.

But now it's so easy and comfortable and wonderful (well it's wonderful for me, I'm sure it's easy and comfortable for her and maybe will become wonderful at some point, or not...) and seems to be a Good idea when times are tough or when she's a bit stressed out.

No worries

I have been really tense the last couple of days. This morning I was right in the middle of that tension when I wrote up my post above. Shortly after that all of the tension let go. It just kind of dissipated.

I needed to be challenged in that particular way, and I needed to respond the way that I did. It closed the loop on something internal for me and the tension surrounding it went away. I feel much better now.

This healing thing is not very comfortable sometimes.

Waiting

Hi Louie,

>I will NOT try to enter her until she wants me to be there.

If you have read slightly between the lines in my blog you will see that i have long taken a 'waiting for her' approach. This started pretty much from day one or our relationship, when i virtually told her that if she wants me to initiate sex shell be waiting a long time. I told myself, had pretty much talked myself into being 'naturally' sexually submissive. That was 6 years ago. For 5 and half of those years our sex life amounted to the scraps that she offered me through this fuzzy construct.

That construct i have come to see was all fear. If i didn't initiate i would not be rejected, simple as that. And in fact i was operating my entire life on the same un-proactive basis.

This karezza journey for me has started a big healing process, where im finding my power. Call it a mid life crisis if you want but it was CPA that started it, and especially Richardsons' material, and some of the stuff you recommended, no more mr nice guy, superior man etc.

But what im trying to say here is: i know now that she needs me to be strong, and part of that is seeing through her moodiness, small talk, avoidance, to gently and patiently prod her back into the present, to a present where she wants to make love as much as i do. And she does, she really does, she's told me she's got so much out of this ('my') karezza journey. Lately she's been crying a lot during sex, and this is saying something because she doesn't cry easily. She too is healing.

But i am telling you that this transformation was all a product of that tricky negotiation back in week 6, where through exhaustive attention and tenacity on my part i got her to agree to a trial schedule. Without that we would still be back where we started. I really believe that.

Now you have young kids, i know how that changes things. My first marriage didnt survive those first few years of kids. I get the sense that the pair of you are probably through that really intense stage, but have come out of it jaded and battle scarred. Hence double the need for some jolt, shift, or change of gear. To get your life back. Get a baby sitter, or just tell the kids that mum and dad 'meditate' from 7-9am on sundays and need to not be disturbed.

That's your role, she wont do it, she's the clucky all protective, the kids come first, one. Plan a couple of weekends away, romantic cottage type of thing, do all the organisation, show her that you value you and her time, and are willing to do something about it. She'll likely resist until you get out the door, then she'll thank you.

And BTW i also got a 'just do it' from emerson, and it made no sense to me either at the time, but it was listening to him that helped us. Just do whatever it takes to make it happen. Karezza will speak to her too.

yep totally agree

spot on.

Blunt: It is possible that you are rationalizing passivity, instead of taking action and saying "it's time for us to have sex. Let's do it this way, a b and c, and try that for two months."

In our relationship I have initiated pretty much everything except social events. And that's fine with me. She likes me to do that. She has these amazing feminine qualities. My masculine quality is goal oriented, initiating stuff, making things happen, using tools. I'm better at that. That's my job.

Maybe it's yours too Louie, with your wife. Maybe the feminine in her badly needs her man to initiate things. Maybe? Just consider that maybe you have gotten out of the habit. You've said you were too much a "nice guy" in the past. I haven't read the book but I have read the forums and I think I kind of get it. Maybe this is being too nice and therefore being not nice?

 

My 2c

As Louie says when you are really at a place of realising your own part in the loss of intimacy, and ready to change, then talking about this earnestly with her will start to rebuild the relationship.

In some circles they call it 'the talk'. The CPA version of the talk is talking about CPA together. If this goes well youll get a pair of ahas, and a willingness to try something new. Then start with the bond behaviors, and do that for a few weeks, then all going well you can go further.

But, doing this while still trying to fix her will go nowhere, probably backwards actually.

BtW, welcome to reuniting. Starting a blog here is a good way to focus on your own journey, and get support at the same time. Give it a shot.

the formula is simple but not easy

you want to re-establish closeness and so you do cuddling, bonding through holding hands and so forth. You can scrunch together next to here when watching TV. You can take her hand when you are out and about walking around.

When you're in bed you can cuddle with her and hold her and stroke her back and her hair.

After awhile she may grow to feel closer to you and you can have sweet intercourse without ejaculation/orgasm as the goal. Don't expect her to have an orgasm or not to have one. Just be concerned about avoiding orgasm yourself. And you don't need her permission not to come, either, nor she yours. If it's what you resolve to do, she will see what you are doing. You can stop things from being too vigorous and you can slow down and savor the time inside her without having an orgasm.

That is what you do to rebuild on your relationship very nicely. You don't "explain" how Karezza will help you. You show her your resolve and you build up all those wonderful love hormones and then let her see it and feel it in action.