♥Bliss without ‘orgasm’

Submitted by rivercurrents on
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Well, first off I'm delighted to have recently found this website! (thanks for making it!). It's been now over two weeks since I had an ejaculation and I'm feeling fantastic so far! I'm very excited about these new ideas..

Now onto my very long post/ question:

I’ve masturbated on average a few times a week via vigorous stimulation to ejaculation since about age 14 (less when I've had a girlfriend but sometimes in addition to regular intercourse). Gradually over the years the experience has become less pleasurable, the sensation has become more localized and generally I’ve felt worse and worse afterward (more tired, headachy, disinterested) as I’ve gotten older (indeed in the fairly recent past I often masturbated purely as a means of getting to sleep).

Now since about three years ago I’ve been doing a lot of personal growth work and counseling, and about two years ago I stumbled upon quite an entirely different experience (an experience that I am slowly becoming more and more able to repeat).

It first occurred while I was lying in bed thinking/ feeling erotic things and fantasies and just lying quite still and relaxed and holding my erection as opposed to moving my hand over it. Then I began to feel a strange but extremely pleasurable detached kind of sensation (beginning in my penis but spreading over my body). It first felt as if my erection was made of wood (numb and solid perhaps?) and was reaching far out from my body (as if I were holding it a few feet above my stomach). Then quite suddenly the strangest and most pleasurable hot wavy melting sensation flooded all over me. My heart rate increased considerably (I could feel a hot pounding pleasurably in my chest and neck) and a deep warmth spread right up over my chest. My initial reaction was that I remembered similar sensations from pleasurable childhood dreams, and then I thought ‘WOW!! So this must be what an ‘Orgasm’ is!!

I’ve heard people describe orgasm as a feeling of waves flowing through the body, and to be honest this is about the closest I could come to describing this sensation (it’s not at all like the localized bursting/ pushing / expelling feeling of ejaculation which personally feels nothing at all like ‘waves’ to me).

However this is entirely separate from ejaculation and after experiencing it I don’t even usually feel any pressure on my prostate at all (and if so, usually only because I happened to come vaguely close to the ordinary ejaculation/ spasm ‘orgasm’ beforehand).

The other thing I notice is that afterward I don’t at all feel empty, tired or disinterested as I do after ejaculation. In fact I actually feel quite energized and alive!

I’ve yet to be able to experience this while having intercourse (I think because I’m unable to relax enough) and I usually just have to be careful to avoid getting anywhere close to ejaculation, and afterward I DO feel quite a bit of pressure on my prostate (even if I managed to stay fairly well away from ejaculation).

The other thing I’ve discovered is that it is possible to have a very similar kind of non-ejaculatory ‘orgasm’ via direct stimulation of my glans (rubbing it against a soft cloth or sheet, or once even from my girlfriend touching it). This sometimes results in a similar non-localised ‘detached’ pleasurable sensation, hot feeling in my chest, rapid heartrate and deep melting wavy sensation.

I’ve found that this ‘orgasm’ gradually fades away of its own accord (after probably lasting a minute or two) and it is quite separate from ejaculation in that I feel no urge to thrust or stimulate myself towards ejaculation throughout the experience (as I do when approaching normal ejaculatory orgasm) and certainly no restraint or effort is required on my part to ‘hold off’ from ejaculating by pushing down on my prostate or contracting my pc muscle or anything (as I feel no urge to ejaculate whatsoever).

So what is this sensation? I’ve read nothing anywhere on the net that comes close to describing it (am I an anomaly?). And clearly it’s nothing at all like those ‘whole body multiple orgasms’ I’ve read about on tantra websites which are supposedly attainable via controlling and holding off ejaculation for extended periods of time and playing around the point of ejaculation (as ejaculation isn’t even in the picture during these 'orgasms').

Have any other men experienced anything similar?

So is this new kind of ‘orgasm’ (insofar as anyone here may have any idea what is going on inside my body!) something to be avoided? (in terms of the themes and the science on this website). It is definitely a pleasurable experience, but I’ve yet to notice the same kind of ‘down’ that I get after the usual spasm/ ejaculation orgasm.

I look forward to any replies!

Thanks so much for your beautiful post

And for letting me know that I have some housecleaning to do in my "Feedback" account. Wink I've been busy updating my book and have got a bit lazy, I see.

Your experience makes me think of a book I read about ten years ago. It said that mankind was going through "an endocrine awakening." I thought, "How nice. That sounds like fun." In fact, it's more than fun, and also kind of uncomfortable. That is, I think there's both a "carrot" and a "stick."

The stick is when we use sex the conventional way and notice that it gives us a hangover. More and more people are making this connection. See this thread at a site started by Cambridge University scientists and researchers about "Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)." I suspect this isn't as rare as these guys think. It's just that the symptoms vary so much, that most men aren't making the connection...they just go for another orgasm to feel better...and get caught in a cycle.

And then there are wonderful experiences like yours that show that we can feel bliss and wellbeing...without orgasm. Who would have thought??? I hope you will tell us more as you experiment. I've enabled you to blog. Here are the instructions: http://www.reuniting.info/resources/bloggers I also deleted your other account.

Now, as for the answer to your question...I don't know. For me the test of whether orgasm is a problem is whether the person notices emotional separation from their sweetheart afterward. It doesn't sound like your experience would lead to this, but only you can judge. Any feelings of separation are, for me, an indication that our mammalian "sexual satiation leads to separation" programming has kicked in. So what do you notice?

Also, maybe your sweetheart would be willing to try a gentle program that lets both lovers steer toward this goal gently. I think she could be missing something really wonderful if she doesn't try relaxing into the same state with you. Read about it here (you could design your own): http://www.reuniting.info/science/ecstatic_exchanges_and_neurochemistry

Finally, although it's lovely to see your smiling face, you may want to choose a different pic, if you want to protect your privacy (not necessary, but you never know...). I'd like to use your thread in my July newsletter, so we can see if we can find some other men who have been having similar experiences. Would that be OK?

Welcome to the site. My husband and I took the ferry to Wellington on our way through NZ two years ago. Beautiful city.


Thanks for your lovely reply

Thanks for your lovely reply Marnia :)
I really enjoyed 'The Ecstatic Exchanges'. I hadn't read that one until now..

No, the experience I wrote about above certainly doesn't lead to an emotional separation at all. Rather I think a sense of deep connection with something all encompassing. The feeling of 'detachment' I wrote about is more a kind of detachment in the sense that the sensation seems to float over and through me from above and below (or perhaps better said it's almost as if it's 'me' that is floating through my body!). Also it seems to take me out of my body and into the blissful universal current and flow of life and love (for want of a better term!), so while I'm aware of pleasurable bodily sensations, I also seem to be separate from them in a delightful 'observing' kind of a way.. so that's why it feels as if certain body parts are 'detached' from 'me' as compared to in normal (I was going to say 'waking') life where my body parts feel very much to be attached and part of 'me'..

I hope to one day be able to relax enough that I can feel this while making love. I imagine that if I could, I would experience a most profound and deep sense of spiritual merging, oneness and emotional union. As it is however, my body still seems to associate being physically close to a woman as the signal to start building pressure in my prostate towards the goal of ejaculation.. And though I now avoid going anywhere near ejaculation, the pressure is afterwards sometimes quite uncomfortable, and of course, this constant eagerness of my body to work towards ejaculation prevents me from being able to relax as completely as I can when I'm alone.

Yes, please feel free to use any of my postings (or snippets thereof) for your newsletter or any other purpose. Perhaps could you include a link to allow anyone to message me if they would like to?

Again, fantastic website!! Thanks for making it happen!

Perhaps if your partner were

Perhaps if your partner were also staying away from the edge of orgasm and not "pulling" you in, it might be easier or more likely that you could experience this relaxation while making love. I've found that the ability to fully relax while aroused is what prevents me from going over. The result of the relaxation is that the inward pullling, contracting of pc muscles, and energetic negative (as in, attracting positive) charge of the orgasmic buildup is distributed more widely through the body. But, if I do cave in to this pulling sensation, the man doesn't stand much of a chance. So, having a cooperative partner could be helpful for you! How's your girlfriend with the notion of withholding from orgasm?

"Pulled in..."

That phrase really resonates with me. I have been aware lately of the importance of not getting pulled in...to a familiar story, or habitual pathway, some fascination with the other...? I feel the need to disconnect from all that, and by whatever technique is at my disposal. I also try to focus on the long view...and I ask myself, what am I trying to feel?



that's absolutely true, it's to participate in the flow...and all this strategizing to get what we think we *need*, when the real thing doesn't require strategy at all. I am watching the people around me, people I love, and these days I can hardly speak about anything...it's so moving just to witness their confusion and suffering, and just nod and hold their hand and try to make them laugh. I say "their suffering" because out here in the field, things don't feel so bad. Call me Jane Goodall. -Galileo

I suspected you were a Taoist at heart!

Exactly. I call it "trusting the Great Camp Counselor in the sky" to arrange things. But our part is important, too. We have to get off the roller coaster. When we're centered, and in the flow, we're "attracting" the events that mirror our greater balance. That's what brings everything into a more enjoyable alignment.

greater balance

"When we're centered and in the flow, we're attracting the events that mirror our greater balance." Beautifully said, Marnia. I feel like that's where I am, and, as Galileo Jane alluded to, I am moved deeply by the people in my life. When there is no "critic", no "judge", no auditor, it's all pretty beautiful, isn't it? I feel like I am currently living in three distinct "streams" or "parallel universes", if you will. This Wendy in the Southwest, another Wendy over here, and another Wendy over there. They all overlap and share things, and they all inform me on a regular basis, but I have no conscious awareness of which direction I will go until I am moved in a direction. It's.....restful.


I can see how it would be different with a partner. And it's also true that some of our reactions are subconscious, related to associations with our partner, and beyond our control. Some people have had good luck with the Exchanges for "resetting their nervous systems." Even Gary and I have used them (or a few of them) from time to time for this purpose, when we sense we're getting too much back into the old "go get it" pattern. However, I would warn you not to keep the pressure on your prostate....whatever you have to do. It's not good for it.

Anyhow, here's a story you may not have seen. Perhaps it will offer some insight. I'll also post anything else that comes to mind. However, I am confident that you will find your own way. It just may take a bit of stumbling around. Winkhttp://www.reuniting.info/wisdom/von_urban_sex_perfection_and_marital_ha...

Thanks for letting me share your material. I'll link to this post, so anyone who wants to contact you will be able to do that simply by joining the site, if they aren't already members. And thank you for your kind words.


If you're not together every night it can be harder to balance your sexual energy. That's why the Exchanges are good. They call for nightly contact, but no hot foreplay or sex for two weeks. That nourishes you both, while also balancing the polarity between you. Then when you add intercourse in, you're a lot calmer. This sounds impossible, but it was our experience.

...could this be part of the solution?

Years ago I experimented with Tantra alone. The approach was approximatly: loving your body, building up sexual energy and then sent the energy in your life, not orgasming. But later I was with a man that was (as I know now) a porn/orgasm addict. While I was with him I even saw women the way such addicts see them, imagine!! With this hungry feeling...

This relationship infiltrated my sexuality in the way that I couldn't do those tantric exercises anymore WiTHOUT having an orgasm. Got kind of addicted, too?? Till now... I am clean for 38 days now and decided to stay it.

What rivercurrents describes could be another possibility to conduct sexual energy through the heart. When no partner is around, for sure.

short record

I tried it three times. No scheduled tantric exercise, just kind of tender stimulation. And it was a very sweet feeling. I did not climax, though I could have very easily.
Important note: My relationship seems to be dissolving, I felt betrayed and used, so my heart hurt a lot. We are many miles apart, no physical contact.
The first time I let the energy flow through my heart into his and felt so much better afterwards. The pain was gone, I felt free and good.
The next day the pain returned because of the silence that was there between us and the disrespect from his side.

The second and third time I just tried to breath it through my heart, it was very sweet. But it seemed to open me too much and the day after I was very depressed, desperate and felt hurt so much.

So I decided to stop experimenting for the time being.

thank you

Sorry for the delay in answering, I didn't forget your suggestion, I just couldn't find it anymore. I absolutely agree with you about "sometimes the only thing you can do is allow yourself to feel the pain".
And thanks for the hugs and the support!!

more bliss

What rivercurrents describes is probably a spontaneous awakening of the inner spiritual power, which is described in almost all religious or spiritual traditions, in one form or another. In the Indian tradition this is called Kundalini. Unfortunately, the knowledge about this spiritual power is a closely guarded secret. When it awakens spontaneously, as opposed to received on a spiritual path, the person in which it manifests itself, is puzzled and possibly starts questioning his sanity.
I had a similar experience a couple of years ago, and decided to give it room in my life. I found a gentle Yoga style, which seems to nurture my experience of bliss. A self-massage, deep, but gentle, into the belly can get the bliss going. Also when listening to certain classical music in a concentrated manner the bliss can arise, and is modulated by the music. And sometimes during intercourse, the bliss gets magnified. (While this all sounds very dry, I left the juicy adjectives out on purpose, because there are just no adequate words for these experiences.)
How does this relate to Karezza? We tried Lloyd's recipe (without having gone through the Exchanges) and the encounter was absolutely delicious. We intend to work through the Exchanges, as soon as circumstances allow. I am looking forward to the unified experience of Karezza and Kundalini, as another experience of my divine nature.