Hellinger on "the deepest accord with the soul of the world"

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"Sometimes people talk disparagingly about "the human sexual drive" and they forget that this is the fundamental force, the deepest force, that guides life and guarantees its continuation. It is a force that enlists us in its service whether we choose or not. If the decision marry and have children really were a rational decision, no one would do it. People do so because of the power of nature's creative force expressing itself in our sexuality. Through this drive, we are in deepest accord with the soul of the world. The sexual drive is the greatest reason. All other motives and rational considerations pale in comparison to the force behind this drive."
"The fruit of the love between a man and a woman are their children. "
(Bert Hellinger - Wie Liebe gelingt - How Love Suceeds - From a public lecture held by Bert Hellinger)

Neurochemics might be the deepest accord of the soul of the world.
And I AM more. And the fruit of the love between a man and a woman should be bliss and blessing (not breeding). And spiraling out of the game...

I disagree

I think both of those views are oversimplifications.

Biological responsibility itself goes far beyond our own children, as biologists are well aware.

If I've said it once, I've said it a thousand times: Biology vs. spirituality is a false dichotomy. The two interpenetrate each other at every point.

Here's a quotation from Lao Tzu

"Understand that true growth comes from meeting and solving the problems of life in a way that is harmonizing to yourself and to others."

Part of that growth may be an expanded conception of our potential and identity, and the potential for our relationships beyond breeding opportunities. One needn't believe in a dichotomy to to stay open to that possibility.

A bit more from Lao Tzu

The Taoists saw no dichotomy...just a natural "evolution." Perhaps some of us are just more restless to "get on with it." Wink

The interplay of yin and yang within the womb of the Mysterious Mother creates the expansion and contraction of nature.
Although the entire universe is created out of this reproductive dance, it is but a tiny portion of her being.
Her heart is the Universal Heart, and her mind the Universal Mind.

The reproductive function is also a part of human beings.
Because yin and yang are not complete within us as individuals, we pair up to integrate them and bring forth new life.
Although most people spend their entire lives following this biological impulse, it is only a tiny portion of our beings as well.
If we remain obsessed with seeds and eggs, we are married to the fertile reproductive valley of the Mysterious Mother but not to her immeasurable heart and all-knowing mind.

If you wish to unite with her heart and mind, you must integrate yin and yang within and refine their fire upward.
Then you have the power to merge with the whole being of the Mysterious Mother.

This is what is known as true evolution.

Divine drive...

Thank you for your input.

What shocks me about this Hellinger-Stuff is, that he is buildung his world-view on mistaking neurochemic addiction-drive for divine drive. And as I know out of experience and observing: The addiction drive (however divine it might be) does NOT make LOVE suceed.

And his desireable vision is this:
"(...) The other Orpheus was a smaller man. He wasn't a great musician. He sang at little parties and played for simple people. He wasn't very successful, but he made them happy and he had a lot of fun. He couldn't make a living singing, so he got an job that wasn't very special, married an woman that wasn't very special and had children that weren't very special either. He committed small and ordinary sins from time to time and was just about as happy as everyone else. He had a very ordinary life and died old and satisfied with life."

What does "about as happy as everyone else" mean? As unhappy as everyone else? (I don't see so much happy people around)
And after all, advertising this kind of living reminds me the "Truman Show". Or the Waltons. "Lead little lifes, don't reach for the stars, keep silent and about as happy as everyone else." Or you'll end up like the big Orpheus (very unhappy, dead and famous). I hope for myself that there is another possibility... Happy might be a good thing to look for.

I demand explanation

[quote=Marnia]The interplay of yin and yang within the womb of the Mysterious Mother creates the expansion and contraction of nature.
Although the entire universe is created out of this reproductive dance, it is but a tiny portion of her being.
Her heart is the Universal Heart, and her mind the Universal Mind.
...
If you wish to unite with her heart and mind, you must integrate yin and yang within and refine their fire upward.
Then you have the power to merge with the whole being of the Mysterious Mother. [/quote]

Why is it always her and her, she and she, mother and mother?

Well, it would be just as bad if not worse if it was he and he, him and him, father and father... but still.

I have a question, too

Why are you so concerned with form rather than substance? Read "A Course in Miracles," and you will see that it uses "he" and "brother" all the way through. Read pretty much any Judeo-Christian tract and you'll see that God is referred to as "he." Lao Tzu happened to be from a different culture, so he used a different pronoun. Big deal.

Pronouns cannot capture a force like the Tao or the Divine, which is encompasses everything, so, IMHO, they're not to be taken overly seriously.

I'm against naming "him"s

I'm against naming "him"s and "brother"s and "father"s too. It's a good question, why I am so concerned with it. I guess it's why feminists are so concerned with the same thing... only that I am not one... or am... or not. Whichever way, it doesn't matter here.
It's just that there always seems to be this premise that women are the holy and divine ones and men should somehow strive to them. Strive to Her. Become like Her. Because Her is better than him. It's always that one gender has to be the better one.

In my experience

looking determinedly for Big Truths has been very worthwhile...even though they have led me to an increasingly simple lifestyle, and more contentment with little pleasures. My inner peace, though, seems to come from feeling that there are good reasons why the world is in such a mess...and that we can strengthen ourselves (and each other) from within - as a way to do something constructive about our collective mess.