Diet and libido. Part 2

Submitted by jb Mirabile-caruso on
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Hi All:

CuriousFellow has suggested - and Amari explained - that, for some technical reasons, it is advisable to start a new thread. I have given it the title "Diet and libido. Part 2", so to preserve a degree of continuity. Effectively immidiately, therefore, we will continue our conversation here. The original thread "Diet and libido" is to be considered closed. Thanks for Your attention and, particularly, for Your valuable contributions.

jb Mirabile-caruso.

Into eros' belly

hotspring wrote:

"Much as cerebral magnetism is important to me, it doesn't sound as fun as bestiality".

You see.... hotspring, You are proposing, here, - to me and to Yourself - an "assumption" that, i think, it would be very wise to leave to its own constricting limitations and destiny. Let me take this whole thing upon myself: i, personally, have experienced Agape only once in my whole life, and that happened in conjunction with my first love when i distinctively felt that, should my beloved girl's life have required my own life being surrendered to be saved, i would have NOT experienced one single moment of hesitation.

Then eros appeared, and - like a cobra - swalowed Agape into its belly. I have never seen Agape ever since! Now, with this experience in the background of my life, i am sure You will readily understand why i cannot accord any credibility to Your proposed "assumption".

"Did you not find bestiality enjoyable in your earlier life"?

Yes, i did! But should a wise person have appeared in my life to open my eyes over the price of my enjoyment, i would today consider myself a blessed person. Instead, i had to go through a lot of suffering to find it on my own. And yet i am forced to consider myself a particularly lucky individual, for, looking around myself among the people of my same age and younger, i see a desolate scenario of total darkness.

jb Mirabile-caruso.

"Foliarism": the only pathway from eros to Agape.

Too bad

you didn't know about karezza, jb. I'm convinced that its most powerful benefits come from agape, even though it doesn't require celibacy.

A book would be nice

Quote jb Mirabile-caruso (from the first post on this long thread): This clarified, the approach that i have developed over the years to undertaking successfully the elimination of the three indicted elements - starch, fat and fire - is the following: 1. Introducing, first, in Your daily life two fundamental factors: an abundance of freshly expressed vegetables juices and an 18-hours-period of zero food intake. During this process the only solid meal of the day will continue to be the regular diet You are presently adhering to. And 2. When this new dietary structure - "vegetables juice" - "regular solid meal" - "18-hours-zero-intake" - is fully established in Your daily dietary life style, then will be time to address the reform of Your diet by gradually and sequentially removing first "starch", followed by "fat" and finally by "fire". The end result of this long process will be a diet made of a vegetables juice, in the morning, breaking the 18-hours-fast, plus a solid mono-fruit meal 3 or 4 hours later.

For clarity's sake, can you recommend a book which will give more details about this diet? Lately, my body is rejecting nearly everything I eat, and this approach seems in line with my earlier studies. But I am wondering, for instance, what is meant by "expressed vegetables juices". Does this include cucumbers and tomatoes or is it strictly green leafy vegetables? By expressed do you mean juiced by way of removing the roughage as when using a Champion Juicer, or grinding the whole vegetable to a smooth texture such as when using a Vita-Mix blender? By fruit, do you include squash and bell peppers? And where do radishes and onions fit in, they being roots?

The book is not available

Hi Larry Stokes:

"For clarity's sake, can you recommend a book which will give more details about this diet?"

The book that You are looking for doesn't exist, for i haven't had the time to write it yet. For correctness' sake, however, let me say that what i am proposing is NOT a diet, but rather the "rational approach" to any dietary reform that a person may consider undertaking. In order to move safely and successfully from Omnivorism, to Vegerarianism, to Veganism and, finally, to Ehretism, we imperatively need a "formula-system", so to speak, which effectively supports the Organism in this gradual, long and challenging process.

In a nutshell, the formula that i have been developing and practicing in the last 17 years of my life stands upon the following two bearing pillars:

- 1. The "green juice" which plays the dual crucial role of - a: assisting the Organism in its long and critical process of detoxication, and -b: importing the necessary elements for its reconstruction.

- 2. The "18-hours-zero-intake" which plays the other crucial role of offering the Organism the most vital opportunity of "contracting itself" in order to excrete its daily toxic load.

In between these two pillars lies the only solid meal of the day that, i insist, be left unchanged till the two pillars become fully established in the person's lifestyle. Only at that time i suggest to start the long process of gradually changing the regimen from Omnivorism all the way to Ehretism. To be observed, at this junction, that there is NO obligation for anyone to travel all the way to Ehretism, for - even by remaining at the stage of Omnivorism - in virtue of my sole "formula" a high degree of health will be surely achieved. It will be understood, of course, that a higher and higher degree of health will be secured as we gradually travel all the way to the biological diet of Humankind: the "mucusless diet" proposed and advocated by Professor Arnold Ehret.

"I am wondering what is meant by "expressed vegetables juices".

It is meant vegetables processed by a juicer - NOT a blender - operating at a low speed, that is, below 100 rotations per minute. Most juicers present on the market are "high speed" and are to be excluded from Your consideration. Juicing vegetables is an expensive proposition in terms of money and time, and You do not want to squander Your time and Your money by obtaining a low quality juice which will not be adeguate to support Your Organism. My advice positively is to buy the best low rotation juicer available on the market.

"By fruit, do you include squash and bell peppers?"

Squash and bell peppers - as cucumbers and tomatos - are "botanically" fruits, but not "dietetically". They are, therefore, to be used as vegetables, along with radishes and onions You are enquiring about. Dietetically accepted fruits are those which simultaneously provide "juiceness" and "sweetness".

With my best wishes of a long, safe and successful journey.

jb Mirabile-caruso.

"Foliarism": the only pathway from Omnivorism to Ehretism.

Juicer's speed matters

Hi CuriousFellow:
The juicer's speed matters because, when high, it is destructive to enzymes and, by producing a high degree of oxidation, it also affects negatively other nutritional elements. If high speed were a sound principle in food chewing, i venture to assume that Nature - or Chance should You adhere to this credo - would have developed, say, a 3.000 bites mastication per minute. Don't You think?

"Do you include the vegetable or fruit pulp in the juice, or do you throw it away?"

First of all, let me clarify that fruits are NOT to be juiced, but to be eaten as they are. Preferebly monistically, that is, one single kind of fruit per meal. Vegetables, instead, on account of our mastication's and digestion's inability to process successfully cellulose, require being processed mechanically. Their pulp is to be discarded, for -a: the breaking up of the vegetables' cells has been accomplished by the juicer, and -b: the pulp would trigger an unnecessaily digestion process which, however, would imply a senseless dispersion of energy. While on this subject, let me remind You that, because even the best low rotation juicer presently available on the market is NOT successful in producing a 100% fiber-free juice, it is highly advisable to filter the juice with a cheesecloth kind of bag.

My best regards,

jb Mirabile-caruso.

"Foliarism": the master pathway from Omnivorism to Ehretism.

j-mirabile - I am agape at

j-mirabile -

I am agape at your commendable attention, care, precision and clarity in these very important matters of the plant helpers! Now I can imagine you clearly eating a single fruit with deep appreciation, "monistically." I imagine you and fruits and vegetables and jesus expanding in blissfull vitality, representing sanity, reason, and verbal elegance.

As far as experiencing Agape is concerned: do you partake of your food in religious fellowship with others? That is one definition of Agape.

I really wonder.....

Hi hotspring:

"As far as experiencing Agape is concerned do you partake of your food in religious fellowship with others? That is one definition of Agape."

I really wonder who could ever define Agape in relation to "partaking of food with others". Most certainly a person who had a theological or philosophical understanding of Agape and would eat about everything under the sun. For, i can assure You that eating a meal of a single kind of fruit constitutes a true communion with God, and the thought of allowing anything or anybody to disturb it simply cannot be.

jb Mirabile-caruso.

"Foliarism": the only pathway back to Eden.


From Wikkipedia:

Eros and Agape (ISBN 0-8446-6051-5) is the title of a two-volume treatise written by the Swedish Protestant theologian Anders Nygren, first published in Swedish in 1930-1936. It analyses the connotations of two Greek words for love, eros (sexual love)and agape (unconditional love), and concludes that agape is the only truly Christian kind of love, and that eros (an expression of the individual's desires) turns us away from God. This may be contrasted with the conclusions of Pope Benedict XVI in his first encyclical, Deus Caritas Est, that both eros and agape are aspects of divine love.

It is more accurate to use "eros" as Nygren used it: transcendent acquisitive and/or philosophical love.

Note: The title of the English translation is Agape and Eros, not Eros and Agape. The Original Swedisch title is: Den kristna kärlekstanken genom tiderna : Eros och Agape, (the Christian's love the idea of all times); a later reprint reduces this to: Eros och agape (Stockholm, 1966). Most translations seem to have adopted that order, with the exception of the English translation. The earliest seems to be from 1930: Agape and Eros, London, 1932. Nygren traces the influence of the Greek eros (which had a much deeper meaning, than it has today) on the early Catholic church fathers and the Protestant development of the idea.

"Dressed" and "naked" Truth

Hi hotspring:

It seems to me that Ratzinger limits Himself - clearly diplomacy-driven - to the "general" statement that "both eros and agape are aspects of divine love", while Nygren - free of political concerns - does not hesitate to be more "specific" in stating that "eros turns us away from God".

Ratzinger's "dressed" Truth is for the "very many". Nygren's "naked" Truth is for the "very few". And we choose what we will. We can go even further and "dressing" the Truth in accordance to our own personal taste and desire. The grandeur of our Human nature lies, exactly, in our unique faculty of choosing to fall and choosing to rise.

Always providentially guided by suffering.

With my sincere regards,

jb Mirabile-caruso.

"Foliarism": the only pathway back to Agape.

Ask your guides

As I see it, Eros easily causes fuzzy thinking (during the hangover after orgasm, or from too much intense sexual frustration - high dopamine). This makes it a spiritual anchor...even for the most enlightened. Both Osho and Adi Da, for example, wrote beautifully, with great spiritual depth and unity consciousness. But both wrongly believed they were above the effects of Eros. And both created major chaos by pursuing it. Osho's Oregon community turned into a failed circus. An Adi Da follower once told me he directed porn movies among his followers at one stage.

Therefore, I tend to believe the Cayce material, which says that if one has not overcome Eros, raising the kundalini simply makes unruly sexual desires more demanding. "The Cayce readings caution that raising the kundalini energy is dangerous unless one has "crucified desire in oneself." Without this preparation, the results are unstable and the kundalini may inflame desires, rather than enhancing true spirituality. Cayce also points out that kundalini techniques are a means of attaining celibacy, rather than spiritual union."

Hence the wisdom of a practice like karezza, which creates parameters in which Eros can play freely, yet without clouding our perception.

I think the ancient Daoists recognized this challenge (from the Hua Hu Ching ) :


Don't think you can attain total awareness and whole enlightenment without proper discipline and practice. This is egomania.

Appropriate rituals channel your emotions and life energy toward the light. Without the discipline to practice them, you will tumble constantly backward into darkness.

Here is the great secret: Just as high awareness of the subtle truth is gained through virtuous conduct and sustaining disciplines, so also is it maintained through these things.

Highly evolved beings know and respect the truth of this.

Eros can be treacherous in that it shifts our priorities without our awareness - if left to its own devices. We don't realize that our changed neurochemistry is altering our perception and judgment. And the more evolved we are, the more likely we are to believe we operate at a level beyond its effects.

Frankly, I'm not sure Eros can ever be overcome on the earth plane. It IS the force of materialism. However, my sense is that we can allow our inner wisdom to guide us in working *with* Eros safely, without fighting it...or letting it push us around.

Eros and Agape

Speaking of one's relationship with a mate, can agape come without first moving through the stage of eros? And, can "true" eros come without first feeling agape?

Falling and rising

Hi Larry Stokes:

Eros and Agape are NOT "two" didtinct and separate emotions. It is rather "one" single emotion manifesting itself "wholly" as Agape and "pathologically" as eros. Please do not get disoriented on account of the word "pathology", but rather follow and reflect upon these two sequences:

- 1. Wholeness = health = function = Agape.
- 2. Unwholeness = pathology = dysfunction = eros.

Now, let me present You with this other parallel analogy: "ego" and "Soul". As with eros and Agape, they are NOT - as commonly believed - "two" different and sepatate entities, but a single "one" manifesting itself "holistically" as Soul and "pathologically" as ego. And again, please observe the following two sequences:

- 1. Wholeness = health = function = Soul.
- 2. Unwholeness = pathology = dysfunction = ego.

So that we can formulate the following mathematical equation:

Soul : Agape = ego : eros,

where the "real" and sole entity Soul experiences the emotion Agape in the primordial, "functional" state of health, and experiences the emotion eros in the fallen, "dysfunctional" state of pathology.

How did Soul fall into "dysfunctionality"? By simply altering its own biochemistry. Not understanding, tragically, what would have been the consequences: the loss of Its true "identity" - now believing to be "ego"-; the loss of Its original "perception"- being now forced to use "rationality" instead -; the loss of experiencing "Agape" - being now condemned to "eros"-; the loss of Its original "communion" with the whole Creation - finding Itself now in a state of desperate "isolation" -.

You may ask, Larry Stokes, what theatre of the city this solo drama performance is played at. We don't need to go very far; in fact, we don't even need to leave the place we find ourselves in at this very moment, for the stage upon which the drama unfolds is the one of our own severely "dysfunctional" brain.

Health IS when pathology IS NOT. Soul IS when ego IS NOT. And so Agape IS when eros IS NOT. Will these three statements answer Your two questions, Larry Stokes? They should.

With my best regards,

jb Mirabile-caruso.

"Foliarism": the only pathway back to cerebral wholeness.

Wheat Grass Juice

Is there a significant difference, nutritionally, between wheat grass juice and juice made from pasture grass? I have been juicing the grass in my "yard" lately, which is all about three feet tall except where I've cut it down with my scythe, and I find the several varieties to have distinctly different favors or tastes.


Your insights are fresh and satisfying. When eros, which one may have been attached to for so long, disappears and something new appears to take it's place, we are left with the job of finding words to describe it.

My next question: for whom do we first feel agape—our Self or another?

In search of Agape

Hi Larry Stokes:

"......for whom do we first feel agape - our Self or another?"

I seriously doubt that Agape may be "selective", that is. limited to a specific single person. Perhaps we should make an effort in understanding that Agape - as Eden and Soul - are not realities residing around the corner, for we have, indeed, travelled very far away from them. My personal experience would suggest that overcoming completely the ego's and eros' conditions so to attain to the permanent experience of Soul and Agape is not an enterprise within our life spans.

We are looking at a very long regenerative process - very possibly implying generations - during which Soul will remain obscured by Its ego-pathology and Agape will remain affected and conditioned by Its eros-state. Answering Your question under these circunstances would equate to pure speculation, and, quite frankly, i do not see the reason, nor the sense, of getting involved in such a venture.

My best regards,

jb Mirabile-caruso.

"Foliarism": the pathway back to Eden, Soul and Agape.

No sex in Heaven! Not even in Hell !!!

From "Thinking and Destiny" by Harold W. Percival:

"In heaven the doer* is a glorified being; it has the breath-form** and senses and can see, hear, taste, smell and touch. It continues its earth life as if there had never been any interruption. But the life is idealized. No sins, no trouble, no sorrow, no poverty, no loss, no sickness, no death; no anger, no greed, no envy and no selfishness will be found in heaven. Heaven is a state of happiness and everything that mars unalloyed happiness is absent. There is no sex, no thought of sex; no shame and nothing to be shamed of. The relations of sweethearts, husbands and wives are there, but idealized. Carnal thoughts, sensuality and dross were burned off in hell. Mothers have their children, whom they lost on earth. It seems as if there had never been any loss. Friends find their friends; there are no enemies. The doers in heaven carry on the occupation they had on earth, but only if their occupations were ideals to them. The good country priest or pastor is the shepherd of his flock and takes care of them as he did on earth; the kindly physician is happy because of the recovery of his patients. The chemist discovers new things which he sees are of benefit to the people. The stateman works in his ideal government. All occupations are free from the thought of gain through loss by others; the heavenly joy lies in the service which is rendered.

There is no sleep, no darkness and no weariness in heaven. There is no eating and drinking for its own sake. There may be eating and drinking if that was a part of the ideal occupation, as a mother's or a host's preparation to give enjoyment to others.

There are rivers, beautiful scenes, flowers and verdure, if the doer longed for them. There are lights, jewels, decorations and heavenly music for those whom this will make happy. The dress of the beings in heaven is as they conceived it as their ideal dress, while they were on earth. The doers in heaven have their religion in heaven if they had it on earth, purified from sordidness, commercialism, bigotry and fanaticism. God will be there in heaven in whatever form he was conceived on earth and the Christ and saints and angels, all will be in heaven as they were believed in on earth, but in an idealized , glorified, exalted state."

*Doer: That conscious and inseparable part of the Triune Self*** which periodically re-exists in the man body or woman body, and which usually identifies itself as the body and by the name of the body.

**Breath-form: Soul.

***Triune Self: The indivisible self-knowing and immortal One; its identity and knowledge part as knower; its rightness and reason part as thinker, in the Eternal; and , its desire and feeling part as doer, existing periodically on the earth.

jb Mirabile-caruso.

"Foliarism": the pathway to asexuality and immortality.

The Fall into Sexuality and Mortality.

From "Thinking and Destiny" by Harold Waldwin Percival:

"In every age a few individuals do find The Great Way. They do conquer death by regenerating and restoring their bodies to the Realm of Permanence. But this is an individual and private affair of each such doer. The world does not know; other human beings do not know it. The world does not know because public opinion and the weight of the world would be opposed to it, and would hold back the doers who choose to regenerate their bodies and restore them to the Realm of Permanence.

Before a human will even agree to the idea of a "Way" to a "Realm of Permanence", he will have become estranged to the concept of an "ascent of man" or "evolution"; that is, that man, with his great gifts, has ascended from a mere speck of matter. On the contrary, he will have become convinced of the "descent" of man, from a higher state to his present low condition in a perishable human body.

Evolution is not merely unreasonable, it is unscientific to suppose that any form of life can evolve from a germ cell that was not involved into that cell. An oak tree cannot evolve fron the germ of a cabbage or a fern, even through countless developments from those germs. There must be the involution of an oak into its acorn in order that there can be the evolution from that acorn into an oak tree.

Likewise every man or woman has descended into this human world of change from an ancestral sexless being of the Realm of Permanence. The descent has been made by variation, modification, mutation, and division. The evidence of this procedure is shown by spermatogenesis and by ovulayion, of the speermatozoon and the ovum into gametes, marriageable cells. Each cell must be changed from its original state or condition, and be modified and divided, until it is distinctly male or female sex cell. These changes and divisions re-enact the biological records of the history of the cells, from the time of the ancestral type of sexlessness until they become male or female sex cells.

Heretofore no definite explanation has been given to account for these misterious facts, but an understanding that the development of the sexes is the degeneration and departure from a former state of deathlessness into the lower human world of birth and death and re-existence, will explain the facts and open the way for understanding that there will be the return from the human to the former higher state. Here is part of the evidence:

Science has furnished evidence that in both spermatogenesis and ovulayion the germ cells must divide twice before the spermatozoon can enter into the ovum and begin the generation of a new male or female body. The reason is that the spermatozoon is at first a sexless cell. By its first division it puts off that of itself which is sexless and is transformed into a male-female part; but as such it is not yet fit to marry. By its second division it throws off its female part and it is then a gamete, a marriageable cell, and is ready for copulation. Similarly, the ovum is at first sexless, it must be changed into a sex cell before it can marry. By its first division it rids itself of its sexless part and it is then a female-male cell, unfit for marriage. By its second division the male part is discarded and it is then the female sex cell ready for marriage.

For each life the history of the transition from an ancestral sexless body is re-enacted by each of the two germ cells."

jb Mirabile-caruso.

"Foliarism": the pathway back to Androgynism and Immortality.