Fear of Repressing my sexuality

Submitted by Sardonyx on
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Dear forum,

First let me say its my first post ...
and am very happy that there is a forum here- it makes this site even more helpful..... -

I'll dive right in, if its ok...:

I have this fear that I will cut the little sensuality I do have in my life.... I am not new to the attempts to reconfigure the centrality of pornography and masturbation-as-numbness... but , paradoxiacally, as it gets clearer , as the problem is more articulated and insights abound --- I feel real panic about repressing completely my sexual self- especially as a shy\bright\spiritually inclined person, I can see how these traits can ALREADY serve to diminish sexuality......

I mean, for example, the concept of complete abstience is easy to understand- just not doing something.
But as we know, that is not the goal in treating compulsive masturbation....
So, will masturbation ever be "not-compulsive"? Will it ever be considered as "healthy"?

These issues are so subtle. My wish is to open up more, not be more neurotic as I already am...

It did occur to me however that, for the soul is us, a goal like "not being addicted to porn" or "not masturbating as means to not be present" is never inspiring. I think the trick is to be engaged in something so that these tendencies would drop by themselves...

It is very late here, so I will continue another time.
With gratitude
Sardonyx

Maybe

If you abstained long enough, like some of the other folks here, you'll find yourself with a lot more confidence and motivation to actually find a partner. Now there's a positive goal!

Welcome to the site

I'm glad you raised this question. In my experience sexual desire is probably the most resilient drive we humans have. Wink

If you went on a diet to get off of sugar, say, would you fear you'd lose your appetite for food? No, right? So why do you think your sexual desire would disappear if you gave up orgasm for a time and let your brain come back into balance?

Here's my theory. It's because you may have seen how porn can desensitize libido...creating the need for more and more stimulation to get a buzz. Now you are fearful of further weakening your libido - and suspicious of strange ideas. Wink If you're wondering what I'm talking about, have a look at these excerpts from Doidge's recent book: http://www.reuniting.info/node/1808

Compulsion DOES lead to tolerance (desensitization...requiring more and more stimulation), but careful management of sexual energy leads to the opposite: greater sensitivity...AND greater self-control.

An addicted brain equates "pleasure" with "indulgence," so "control" sounds like it can never lead to pleasure. This is a mistaken assumption. The more sensitive you get, the more delicious lovemaking is (and the more sparkle your whole world of experience has). And having self-control during the process simply makes it more so.

Right now, you can only feel "bangs" sexually, so none of this makes sense logically. The point of experimenting with abstinence for an extended period is simply to see what you see. You can always go back to your old habits. I promise you will feel different...in surprising ways...as your brain comes back into balance. And when you use your new state of mind to connect with others, you'll feel even better!

Bye for now. Time to party!!

I am not sure if this will

I am not sure if this will fit with what you are saying/asking. I do know that before I started this healing process. That I was having trouble with erections. I was needing more and more types of stimulation from porn and it still was not helping. I was getting really worried about the whole thing. It had been getting worse and worse for a couple years. Well that anxiety just helped push me deeper into porn as it went along. Hard to believe I could keep getting deeper into it. I mean I probably used every type of porn image and vid out there except for one and that was child porn. What scares me is could I have gone that route one day ? Well at least now I will never know. I am very grateful for that at least. sorry back to what I was saying. Well I was a mess because of this addition and still am. The more I go without porn masturbation and orgasm well the more difficult it becomes to not get an erection lol. Yeah I have had one or two times in the last few weeks where I had to calm myself or be embarrassed. So in my round about way I am trying to say that if you stay away from porn and masturbation your sexual desire will go up. It will go up in a good way. OK that sounds funny rereading it did not mean it that way bad wording. I am not making fun here or anything like that. It is a serious topic and touchy I know.

Will masturbation be healthy ? I think it could be. I am thinking after getting in balance there could be a schedule that would work. That is if you are without a partner. This is kind of a new thought to me. Maybe Marnia can correct me if I am way off.

I got caught in that mind trap of OMG never have another orgasm or masturbate again how the #$@% can you even think like that. Why would you even want to think like that. That is crazy. My completely addicted and unbalanced mind just freaked out. I think if I remember correctly that when I fully tried to think like that. the thought of what am I going to do never have another orgasm and my brain just broke. I binged for like 4 days I think. My mind just could not process the thought of going without at first. Well that thinking I learned is wrong. As I get closer to a balance I see things differently. I even see and think that maybe I really do not need orgasm to feel good. Well I do not think it I know it. That is hard to see at the start of this. It is very hard. It is like banging you head into a brick wall over and over hard. Once you get going though it starts to make sense. It starts to clear up in your head a bit. It really does get better. I am proof of that as well as a good many other great people on this site.

got rambling and long winded.
Welcome to the site. I hope you are able to find what you need here. May you find balance.
Just keep an open mind. Do not let it overwhelm you. Just try to listen and share. See how things go.

hope you enjoy this site
be safe

I could look

at those two White Tiger cubs all day, so thanks for your blog and the image!

I am new to this site myself and a first time blogger, cannot get tell you how useful it has been so far- only at day 19 of abstaining , but this is for the first time since age 9, certainly in looking at porn. The wisdom section is great if you do have a spiritual inclination.
I find abstaining long term, even passed day 21 at the moment as truly mindblowing- the tension headaches are testimony to that.
However, for me, the porn , orgasm, shame, dissonance, depression, craving cycle goes so contra to my aspiration of living fully in the moment without fantasy and open heartedness, that it was tearing me apart. To see sexual energy as a mega booster for spiritual progress is what is getting me really excited, but then I am a devoted fan of Lao Tsu.

Anyway, good luck with your journey and welcome on board

Sexual repression

I'm new to the forum. Just wanted to respond to your question about repressing sexuality since it has been a question on my mind for quite a while also. I have recently concluded that there are alternative ways of expressing my sexual energy in much more healthy ways other than orgasm. Just to name a couple: 1. Having fun and playing with friends socially. 2. Finding ways of helping others who struggle with the same issues. (I've had the wonderful opportunity to practice both of these through 12-steps programs related to sex and other addictions.)

In Light and Love.
FV

I took out your name.

I'm a bit like a mother hen, I know, but people have been found by search engines and it has been awkward...because of the delicate topics discussed here. So please stick to your nicknames...especially when you put up your handsome photos!

Thanks,
*cluck, cluck*

Long-term abstinence from orgasm

I've had 5 months and three weeks abstinence from orgasm and pornography at one point in time. Currently I have about 3 months and 2 weeks. I have been rigorously interested, studying and practicing western spirituality and mysticism for over 10 years. I am 32 years old. The long-term periods of abstinence seem to have greatly contributed to my sense of spiritual growth and wholeness. I also feel that my sex-drive has remained quite healthy. (I get daily erections.) My sense of intimacy has also grown both with friends of the same sex as well as with attractive women. My growth has happened slowly over a couple years and I still have quite a way ahead of me. I would like to express gratitude to The Great Spirit for having allowed me the opportunity to experience a life free from pornography and masturbation.

In Light and Love.
FV

Thanks so much

for your contribution, and welcome to the site. I'll enable you to blog...if you promise not to use your name. Wink

Like you, I've found that passion is useful for all kinds of things...and one doesn't become less passionate by channeling sexual energy in those other directions.

Looking forward to your spiritual insights. What inspired you to make the change?

Thats Awesome

3 months is no small task! Nice work.

I agree, I feel like my spiritual life is so much better while abstaining. I experimented with it this summer and the difference was like night and day. After years of feeling awkward, I finally felt like I was "normal" again. Especially after being in some dark pits of depression over the years. To have that kind of experience has given me the sight and hope for the future instead of thinking that I was permanently defective.

I find the mysticism aspect interesting too. Ive known quite a few spiritually/esoterically minded people over the years get stuck in sexual addictions. Its one of the hardest things to control in spiritual life and in vedic traditions has been attributed to the fall of many saints and yogis. Its probably one of the most powerful aspects of spiritual life and development. I knew one kundalini practitioner who "snapped" one day and she had a line of men outside her door for sex! (Not literally, maybe though, I wasnt there) I know that the vedas mention a correlation between loss of semen and nervous disorders and recommend to only have sex for procreation.

Wow!

This website is great. It is such a blessing to have other people who have had similar experiences and understand.
I was inspired to change by the pitiful and incomprehensible demoralization that porn and masturbation helped me to come to after 17 years of doing it daily for an average of an hour or two a day. I also spent about 3 or 4 hours daily looking online hoping to find sexual partners for several years. I lost good jobs, a career of over 7 years, apartments, cars, and ultimately all my self-confidence (what little I had to begin with). After devoting lots of time and effort in working the 12 steps for about 3 years I believe I have begun to have a spiritual awakening which has come to happen slowly and over a period of time. It seems to be of a more profound nature than the awakenings I seemed to have before with other systems of spirituality. My conscious mind seems to be more serene than I remember having it ever before (similar to the brief moments of clarity experienced in my childhood). The people who are following my footsteps and the people who are trudging the path ahead of me continue to inspire me daily which I believe helps me to remain on the path. I look forward to finding a female companion in God's time and according to His Will for me. In the meanwhile I have lot's of areas in my life which require work and attention. With the help of God my life is a gift today. It use to seem like a curse at many times in the past.

In Light and Love.
FellowVoyager

It has gone *slightly* off topic.. ahm...

thanks all for your comments. I will respond in detail soon. Please I would like if on this thread we could investigate the fear expressed in the topic...
I have been inquiring for myself about this issue, and will let you know what i've come up with.

Just a note re: sainthood and addictions -- just to let you know that modern day teachers also have had such problems; think of Maezumi Roshi, a profound influence on all western Zen development, was an alcoholic; and another bright advaita\zen teacher, Adyashanti, took eight years to wean off smoking... and the founder of Shambhala Tibetan Buddhism , Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche, whose influence is extensive also, was an alcoholic as well if I am not mistaken;
This is not to taint anyone's image - it is to say that the addicted energy works on different levels, and is not mutually exclusive, to attaining certain 'spiritual' achievements and insights. That's why Ken Wilber has made an incredibly important distinction in regards to (spiritual) practice- there is body-work, subtle-body-work, study (i.e. philosophy\right view\framework\dharma), spiritual work (state cultivation) AND (!) shadow-work (disowned\projected self). In practice things are not as clear cut but the point he made is that one can excel in the insights and spiritual state cultivation yet still have much 'shadow' issues... which presumably lead to addictions.

peace
sardonyx

"If you don't have a problem-I will give you one"

A Zen saying S. which I find a degree of comfort in. In otherwords, if we are not fully engaging with the 'passions' then either we are not on a spiritual journey or we have already reached the state of bodhisattva! So whatever your addiction, that's part of being human ( the realm of the Hungry ghost) it's what you choose to do with it- that's why I repeat that we are all striving for something pretty special here , when the rest of the World is hurtling towards dopamine fuelled highs in increasing variety.

Buddha only ever professed to be human, even Christ took on human form to go through all the cravings- both were tested by gorgeous beauties but managed to win though. Surely the message is that we are all fallible, but do we stay in the realm of the Hungy Ghost or do we strive to be fully in the Human realm, practicing virtue? In this context, afraid these 'fallen' examples just give me a good laugh.

Back to the subject....

I wonder if a distinction needs to be drawn between phases. That is, if someone's leaving porn behind, then they reallly seem to benefit from abstinence, even if it feels like "suppression" - at least for a couple of months. For example, when one of the guys here tried to do exercises to draw his sexual energy upward, it just caused an instant ejaculation...and a return to square one. Wink

On down the road, I think it's equally important to learn how to "rechannel" one's sexual energy - without suppression. At that point, the rechanneling exercises seem to offer comfort. They spread the sexual energy throughout the body somehow and can increase energy, focus, workout performance...and charisma.

Ultimately, the goal of this site is to reunite male and female through the practice of karezza without any sense of "repression." The technique is "just don't go near The Edge," while still engaging in lots of daily affection and gentle intercourse that ends in a sort of sexual meditation, rather than a Big Bang.

Using karezza, you don't have to fight yourself...or suppress. (Yes, we all discover our options by *sometimes* going too near The Edge and OVER the edge...and prefering the results of not doing so.)

Anyway...looking forwrad to your thoughts Sardonyx.

hi

absolutely the worst days of recent years. lost most trust in myself ("relapse") but also tantrum and divide between me and my therapists. now feel really helpless. i'm so pathetic in this world at least

*big hug*

I'm sorry. I don't suppose it helps for you to hear that this is perfectly *normal,* eh?

What happened? Were there any specific triggers that you know you can avoid next time?

Try not to be so hard on

Try not to be so hard on yourself. I have done that a lot also. both the relapse and the beating myself up. I know how much it just sucks to lose control. Just try to learn as much as you can from the relapse. I know I hated hearing this at first but it does help to hear it. It will get easier and better. It is still now easy for me. It is just easier. that does not say it well. It is hard to put into words. It just does not feel as bad as time goes on. Remember even resisting cravings and urges for just and hour is a win. Relapses are going to happen. I do not think anyone on here has managed to go without many relapses.

So hoping you are feeling better soon.
wishing you well
be safe

i can't go on

for 3 days without orgasm . my top is about 10 or so days. but to be honest i wish this was the real issue. things are just falling apart.. my social anxiety is at the top, i don't go out of my (empty) house unless i feel safe which is rare. i was supposed to go today to a small 1 night trip with my brother and couldnt managed to do so because i was so drowsy from the antianxiety pills. i am losing trust in everything. i am so alone as well. i dont know what i want even.

Not sure how long you've been here...

but there's a pretty strong correlation between frequent masturbation and social anxiety. By that I mean that when you get yourself back in balance, you may find out that you really aren't prone to social anxiety. You may even bloom into "the life of the party." I have seen amazing miracles here. Did you read this article? http://www.reuniting.info/cowardly_lion_masturbating_too_much

So first thing is to be optimistic. Smile

The other aspect of this p/m-social anxiety connection is that ANY, and I mean ANY, friendly contact with your fellow humans is enormously helpful in regaining control...even when you REALLY don't feel like it.

So what can you do to connect? Can you post here more often? Instead of the drugs that make you sleepy, maybe try meditation instead http://www.reuniting.info/download/misc/06Track6.wma (or find a group meditation)? Get some exercise? Take walks in the mall and look others in the eye?

Other ideas anyone?

Sorry

A lot of us guys here have been through this in one form or another. Yes, its brutal. But its not totally hopeless because a lot of people's lives have improved by recovering from this addiction and you are no different than us. Addiction is completely treatable when you put the effort in.

I think you'll find that your social anxiety and many of your mental maladies will find relief by you becoming proactive in your recovery. We are all trying to get out of this maze ourselves here too.

best

People in your corner

Despite currently being a social/people person, I was not always this way - if anything, spouse and I have totally switched - she was outgoing when we met/were friends for years, I was the total social introvert - but not just for general shyness - my developmental/teen/early 20's years were socially painful specifically because I had excessive (literally compulsive, bordering on obsessive) masturbation habits and orgasm addiction - both because of parentally-induced shame regarding "that part" of my body - plus my mother always told me I was "cheating myself" with masturbation, and she policed me totally during my entire childhood and late teens - we're talking supervised bathing/showering and restroom trips, random "inspections" during the night to see if I was either sleeping naked or pleasuring myself - not that it's a thing to claim proudly, but I'm the only person I know of either gender who was put over the knee and soundly punished for one masturbation act out (granted, it was a pretty profoundly dangerous and irresponsible one) at age 17. But aside from those parentally inflicted stigmas, there were also some me-specific particulars in terms of mode of masturation/sexual act out that had my own skin crawling on a daily basis (I don't say this to minimize or ridicule/take it lightly - but comparatively, I've sometimes wished that I had "only" been a porn-inspired masturbation addict, as opposed to what was fundamental to masturbation/orgasm/sexual release for me at the time). I'd spend school hours in nervous anxiety and agony, fearful that every look, every word, from schoolmates was some indicator that they knew what I was doing behind closed doors - so I know what it's like to carry the anxiety about being around others, whether it's fear of a trigger or fear of being seen right through for all your alledged bad habits, even what it's like to be unwilling to be around others because you might actually meet someone you like/are attracted to, only to keep yourself in check because self feelings/self image can make you think you're dirty or undeserving of having a healthy functional sexual experience. Yeah - it sucks. It's taken me years to get thru it, and sometimes it still resurfaces.

Sometimes the truth isn't good enough. Sometimes people deserve more; sometimes people deserve to have their faith rewarded.

OMG

It's amazing the damage that the well-intentioned parent can do, eh? Sounds like a sure way to get someone hooked on masturbation...and feeling guilty about it. Frankly, I'd like to give your mom a spanking! Grrrrr......

Did "punishment fantasies" end up as one of your triggers by any chance? Wink

HMMMMMM :)

ok peeps.. I've decided to open up a blog ! (here).
In it, I will post two kinds of enteries:

1- confessions.
2- resources I've collected along the way that might aid (a but ashamed here, as I'm still strongly battling this issue- none the less, for the past 2 years I have tried an assortments of ideas).

sincerely yours
Sardonyx