Submitted by nana on
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I would like to know if there is any information or studies on lack of penitrational orgasums and weather or not there are solutions.

for nana

I'm not sure if you're still checking this forum or not, but this is a really huge and important topic that you bring up.

Perhaps no-one has replied to your question because the point of this website seems to be to focus on not having orgasms, rather than figuring out how to have them.

Still, I find your question totally valid. In my own journey, not being able to have orgasms from penetration was very frusterating. Since I can now have them, I am able to make the choice not to, but my general orgasmic ability makes sex extremely pleasurable even if I don't go all the way, and I prefer to have the choice.

I consider the fact that many women are unable to have vaginal orgasms a huge problem, one that speaks very clearly of our culture's legacy of female circumcision in the metaphorical sense.

In my own journey, I observed the following stages in my growth to being vaginally orgasmic:

1) anger, frusteration, and sadness
2) years of research with unsucessful results
3) expression of my anger to my lover and god
in an undestructive but direct way
4) finding a pace and position while having sex that hit me in the right spots
5) abandoning my identity of myself as someone who was unable to have a vaginal orgasm and embracing a new way of seeing myself

The journey continues:
6) taking good care of myself physically and emotionally - this means pure food, exercise, spiritual practice, and generally doing things that are invigorating and energizing
7) only being with lovers who i have real chemistry with and genuinely enjoy
8) GRADUALLY strengthening the pelvic muscles through balanced expansion and contraction of muscles (not just contraction)
9) practice of meditation and sexual techniques outlined in mantak chia's books (ovarian breathing and compression)
10) finding a non-hormonal partner-based form of birth control that allowed me to stop bringing fear of pregnancy into my experience of sex (this is another topic altogether, but HUGE in allowing women to let go in sex)
11) taking full responsibility for my own sexual experiences. This includes: examining my attitude towards my body, learning to love it and be comfortable in it and learning to share it; never having a limited view of what i am potentially capable of experiencing in sex; learning to love giving and learning to love receiving; fully accepting where i am at on my journey as perfect for my growth.

While a lot of this is psychological, not all of it is, so don't beat yourself up psycologicall for not being able to have orgasms in sex, since a lot of it is technical. Everyone's body is totally different, so I can only share what works with me:

1) make sure the chemistry is really there. how much you enjoy kissing your partner is a good indicator
2) make sure you're wet before you go to penetration (kissing, licking the lovely penis, and having my nipples sucked works best for me)
3) push your abdominal muscles down when he enters you, so that any air is expelled and the vacuum creates a very tight fit.
4) have the guy start out slow and sweet, with a consistent rhythm
5) examine your feelings towards him. if you are closed off somewhere, ask yourself if you can fully accept him and do so; otherwise, you should probably not be having sex with him
6) find the spots that turn you on; the more you look, the more you'll find. The opening can be very sensitive, the hammock like muscles on the backside of the vaginal wall that grip the penis upwards are very sensitive, and gentle consistent tender touch near the cervix can be lovely; any of these spots are enhanced if the man's pelvis rubs against your clitoris or if you touch yourself during sex.
7) once you've had a few orgasms through penetration and you know you are capable of it, try getting to that space right before orgasm and relaxing into it, staying in that highly charged space, dispelling the charge through sound, deep breathing, and meditation with your partner. swim and have fun without orgasm! broaden your idea of what a peak sexual experience is.
8) know that having orgasms is your birthright and that the energy already exists there, its just a matter of attuning to and tapping into that which you most essentially are - an ecstatic being. like enlightenment, there is nothing to "reach" except our deepest understanding of who we already are. There is no place to go - its all there, available to us in our openness!

Thanks for handling this

so generously and thoroughly.

For many women the path to moving beyond orgasm lies through releasing whatever has blocked their sexuality in the past. Only then are they feeling generous enough to nourish a partner with an open heart. Incidentally, it is their openness that most assists their partners in gaining control, too.

Personally, I find it sad that society - and even sincerely well-intentioned advisors - make women feel that there is something wrong if they don't easily orgasm during sex. Perhaps some deep part of them (never validated) recognizes that there is a higher form of pleasure and wisely avoids this "short circuit." Nevertheless, each person's path is her own, and my personal path was to become very orgasmic during intercourse...before realizing that it was carrying me away from my heart's goal of sustainable relationships.

It seems that the more one's heart opens, the more one values harmony with a lover. At that point, the recognition that pursuit of our "birthright of orgasm" often creates emotional distance (perhaps not immediately, but over the two weeks following) makes it possible to move beyond this pursuit. Also, when both partners conserve the energy, no one feels the frustration of being "left out," so passing up orgasm is not a big source of loneliness and frustration.

I suspect that gentle, non-performance-oriented Exchanges, of the type recommended at this site, would best help women get their hearts open. I'm not sure that becoming very orgasmic helps at all with that goal.

You may find this link of interest: http://www.aypsite.org/T50.html

While each person's path is her own, I think it's important to make public the concept that orgasm may NOT be the ultimate solution to every woman's problems. It may simply be a bus stop on the way to a larger goal. Penetrational orgasm may not be a required stop for everyone, and women should be made more aware of other possible routes and goals.

I agree with all that you

I agree with all that you say, Marnia. I certainly don't want to reinforce the notion that there is one ideal way to respond sexually to a man. I'm aware there are many women who do not have vaginal orgasms or orgasms at all who are still very erotic people who enjoy sex. I commend them for being able to get over society's pressure to perform, and have healthy and gratifying sexual experineces despite this (or, as you say, perhaps because of this).

However, my experience in speaking with girlfriends over the years (and I talk about sex with almost everyone i know well) is that this inability can be a source of extremely deep pain. And, since I know it can be overcome, I find it important to share my journey with women who know that they want to have that capacity. To those who don't, power to them! I know I'm certainly glad I was dogged about being able to have that ability, because it showed me that I can take responsibility for manifesting what i feel is important in my life.

Some of the ambition of wanting to be orgasmic probably has something to do with the prestige of being perceived as someone with sexual prowess, and I don't think this is by any means the highest attitude to bring to our approach of sex; nevertheless it is real.

As you mentioned, each woman has her journey, and I'm happy that I started out not being able to have orgasms, then came to have them, and now am choosing not to. I certainly don't think having an orgasm is the be-all and end-all; it's a culmination of a broader sensibility, and that sensibility, or enjoyment of orgasmic energy, is extremely energizing whether I choose to reach the full climax or not.

Thank you also for the article link - it was fascinating. My experience is that multiple orgasms are draining but fun once in awhile.

FYI I've been ejaculating without reaching orgasm quite easily. The two are definately not the same. I'll let you know if I notice any depletion (note: I have been taking maca powder for the past few weeks to balance my hormone levels and regulate my periods; maca root is known to increase sexual desire and potency, something I don't feel I really need; however, if I can channel this energy in creative directions in my life instead of externalizing everything onto a mate, I feel it could be beneficial for my whole life.)

Thanks again for the forum, and the time and thought you put into it.

Orgasm is a draining energy.

Orgasm is a draining energy. What is happening is that the nervous-system is discharging excess build-up of excited energy which creates abnormal blocks in the flows of both a) normal hormonal balance in that system and b) energy (shakti\chi) that is designed to nourish internally and externally (both you and your partner).

In my experience; if one builds up energy through expectant, goal-oriented and excited intercourse and then suddenly try to 'relax' in the moment before orgasm - it creates unresolved tensions in the body. Although you may have avoided orgasm and gone to a more intimate and moment-oriented sexual connection; you still have unresolved tensions that result from that very excitable and high-dopamine build-up. It may be possible to then try and "dispel the charge" through touching, etc but still that excited energy is always trying to come out if there is excess of it circling in the system. It will then start sending signals to the muscles and various glands to literally push that energy out draining some beneficial energy out along with it in the process (hormones rising and falling in response). This will reduce the degree of intimate union and possibility of remaining present with your partner affectivley diluting your erotic bonding experience.

What needs to be done instead is to sit naked facing each other and through a combination fo mutual touch, kissing and mutual breathing you will find a unique sense of erotic energy which is not overly excitable. The man should then enter the woman and then remain still and absorb her energies that naturally start flowing out of her; he shows his appreciation for her love through kissing and words and she the same. The philosopy of "in giving, you receive" should be adopted with mutual adoration and respect. Eventually the two will feel a transcendental connection between them based on non-buildup related connection whilst at the same time maintaining a LOW to MODERATE degree of physical arousal in the lower centres of the body. There are nerve-endings in the vagina for similar reasons that there are nerve-endings in the feet; as the physical-manifestation of energy channels to carry (and also absorb) energy out of the body and into it. To excite these nerve endings is to disrupt and agitate this gentle nourishing flow and in the long-term orgasmic reactions in the vagina, clitoris, etc will turn the woman into the "bitch from hell", "horny frustrated" etc phenomena that we both see in us and around us.

Let us all utilise the immense river of positive creative and nourishing energy that sexual contact offers us. Its immensely powerful and should not be abused for the sake of sexual sensationalism and personal satisfaction.

the key is opened spinal channel

orgasmic energy is really draining and very detrimental, therefore a great emphasis on continence and sexual restrain takes place in any religion... Tantra is not an exception, it avoids orgasms by any means, still it uses sexual urge for spiritual development; but first of all the spinal channel of energy should be opened, become more sensitive; then, even slight focusing of your mind on upper centers( I use to concentrate on heart center -- between the shoulder blades)- absorbs the energy of excitement and increase the awareness of this center concomitant with feeling of Universal love. It is so profound absorbing experience, that you forget all sexual component, you feel deep peace and love, it is a deep blissful meditation increased even more by mutual influence of both partners. In this state of mind you can stay very long time and feel very much refreshed and rejuvenated after this. Although you have to pass the preliminaries; to develop sensitivity of your spinal channel before actual practice, otherwise the permanent sexual excitement in sexual area won't let you peace, when it habitually stuck there.

I would also like to say

I would also like to say that in putting too much emphasis on the woman's orgasm; the danger is that it fuels the male ego. It is particularly vulnerable in fuelling mens sense of pride in being the total authors of womens convulsive and submissive pleasure; and in a lot of sexual experiences - the man is having a massive ego high. It then becomes a case of man being the only giver and the pleasure he gets is the satisfaction of being the source of the orgasmic power and love and she returning only in appreciative grunts and moans. I've spoken to some women who not only became estranged with their partners after many experiences of orgasmic sex; but also noticed a gradual reduction of love in their intimate experiences with their partners - and more selfish intercourse. Some women even enjoy being dominated as part of this orgasmic addiction. Its sadly; very powerful and very hard to shift from the brain when it is entrenched - but it is doable with spiritual and intellectual courage.

ok. Penetrational orgasms.

ok. Penetrational orgasms. That topic is deep.

I was thinking.. you know. The contractions which follow after an orgasm make sex afterwards feel like... unsmooth/rough. Centered around, the "breaking" point.

After having not ejaculated for so long I've been trying to find a smoother type of stimulation, one that doesn't go towards a goal of sharp-edgy type of orgasm, but more for a smooth up and down feeling. That would change the whole association (at least in my opinion) of damage that is sometimes associated with more pleasure in the female (ie going until you feel like you've broken something, or whatever, which gives it an 'edge'). Many people actually think that pain would = pleasure. Because of the sharp contractions associated with orgasm, make you want to go faster, rougher and penetrate harder, and until there's hurt to be transmuted. It can change the whole game around, making women prefer men with rougher more edgy qualities, and even feed off of this. Same with men, getting their dopamine rushes off the bang, as if they are brutally winning at some competition their malignant pride soars. Or maybe it's just cuz I've never had a relationship before, that I see and associate relationships with such fearful things, but I mean just think about it. Women losing their virginities in pain and blood. Animal females usually run away from males and it's very likely that females also participate in this tradition. A victim-predator thing. Families protecting their offspring, it really give sex a really rough quality.

I wonder if one does not have the normal "orgasmic" type sex, one can associate love with a much smoother quality like a valley or dune. Rather than, a cliff, or sharp edginess to it. It's hard because... even when I think of more smoother type of pleasure I have imaginary contractions (which even THAT leads to an orgasm cycle).

now.. I've never really had bonding relationships with females. Nor even sexual. But I could imagine that the dopamine rushes and oxytocin rushes feel different. I would imagine.. but I may not be correct.. in thinking that.. and I've noticed this too. When I'm around a woman, I get a sharp feeling of shakiness or nervous anxiety, if my focus is centered around my genitals. But if I continue, it feels like it's sexual energy that needs to be unblocked through bonding activities perhaps focused in the lower chakras, and rather than 'traditional sexual orgasm' type.

I usually feel in my aura, a distinguishable boundary whenever I'm around a woman but if I 'penetrate'.. I feel warmth and as if I'm surrounded by soft all encompassing uhm... something. Maybe THAT is oxytocin, and the dopamine (and maybe even testosterone) is associated with the sharper more edgy qualities of that boundary. I'm not saying I have orgasms.

But let's say, I touch a girls hand. I feel like blanket (imagine I'm cold) coming over my but only halfway or so. One half of my body is anxious and the other body is calm, but in the boundary between the two there's a sharp boundary of.. well it kinda feels intense. The moment, it becomes a full on holding hands in a way that is deeply connecting it feels as if the entire blanket it covering me and I'm wrapped up in warm goodness and that anxiety goes away. That type of thing.

But since I've never had bonding based relationships with any woman in my life, I constantly feel anxiety, and whenever i am around a woman I feel that sharp edgy quality. I would imagine if I had felt touch from a woman long enough I could carry that smooth quality of bonding into other aspects of my life. I could fall into focus faster, I could concentrate better. I could relax into life, dream with ease, smile easily without having to have it feel like I have to cross some grand threshold point, I could feel good.

So maybe that feeling of being wrapped in warmness is oxytocin. And that feeling of REAL connection, of oneness. And dopamine is associated with that 'threshold' point.

I dont know what I'm talking about. But I was just thinking about these things , and I have thought about it befre.

maybe I also need to stop associating strongly sharp contractionary orgasms with a painful quality. It's hard though sometimes especially when you're alone. maybe sexual energy is just burning me up from inside like a hot knife with a sharp edge quality.

and this is what stops me from having good quality interactions with women so I'd rather just give up. There's no fixing me. perhaps women feel it in my aura, the burning quality and it gives them pain.

problem is, it doesn't go away with masturbation or orgasm either. it's like, to have any real sort of meaningful communication with a female I'd have to walk over hot coals. It doesn't seem like I can just change it by not paying it any mind, or make it go away, it's physical. Maybe with hypnotism.

Interestingly,

cortisol, stress hormone, rises during a sexual encounter (and possibly before it) perhaps giving it that edgy quality. But when male rats were allowed a half hour of sexual contact each day (not necessarily to ejaculation), the cortisol response didn't kick in.

Support for karezza? Smile