♥Desire

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19 months on the path, kind of

[quote=Keith Shein "Rumors Of Buildings To Live In"]
Never enough.
Now the boy wonders if he has the right desires,
what a better man might want,
whether there's a desire more pure.[/quote]
Thinking about y'all

Laying with my Isadora last night, I was looking for my gifts. How do I give, when I want so much?
My mistake with karezza was to want it, expect it, feel entitled to it..... substituting my desire for orgasm for wanting intimate connection.

The kisses are longer, sweeter....she, no longer the shy filly

Comments

My Mellowness

I think (my projection) is that over a year and a half of my struggle to find a new way....a way to have sex without the focus and expectation of orgasm has shifted me. I still struggle with desire for her response, but by gawd, I'm so much mellower, less anxious.....and grateful. (BTW porn sure jacks up my expectations and frustrations)
So I've been doing one sided karezza on and off....OSK is weird and dangerous (for us) if my expectation is that she will be a loving active partner in the exchange. 2X4? hell, I brought out the 12# sledge hammer. "I want a satisfying sexual relationship. I've thought of divorce." Agreements were made, broken, revised. One day I noticed she didn't shy from my kiss....and hasn't since.
karezza? my decreased anxiety? overt threats? Who the hell knows what's going on?....but it's going on, and it's good.
Thank you dear Marnia
Blessings on us all

Query and Muddled Thoughts

Hi hotspring, wish you well
I've had hints, and now, I am closer than ever to chastity. Just let go of sex.....kind of....let go of my attachment, chill the expectation, enjoy the pleasure. I touch her and am thrilled at the feel of breast or thigh. I want a loving connection. I'm thinking with such excitement and objectification we'll just go down that old road to fucking. But asking for what I want leads to loooong discussions and alienation. New plan is to ask for what I want when nothing is on the line (before we go to bed....the old way was for me to ask before we parted..."last call"). When we are in bed, focus on being grateful, and back away from the thrill... at that very first impulse....try calmness. I might be ready.

[quote="A Symphony in the Brain" by Jim Robbins]...Kim, who is...in charge of donor recruitment at a Southern California sperm bank.[/quote] Hmmmm, what does that job entail?

Saturday Return

A week away from home....near Yosemite....eating out on the boss' dime.... a day long class with Anat Baniel http://www.anatbanielmethod.com/workshop-schedule.htm She has a real gift. I've studied with two people she has trained and that work has healed my chronic low back pain.
Traveling 10:00 AM to 11:00 PM with 3 women in a car. A few hours in Yosemite Valley, lunch at the cathedral like Ahwahnee Hotel....water in the falls after 3 days of thunder storms...dogwood starting to turn....hearing the multilingual voices of awe.
All day wanting to touch, caress, and kiss one of my fellow travelers. Two of them are old friends. She of my desire, is not my Isadora. In the back seat of the car, in the dark, I watch her sleep, wanting to hold her in my arms. She sits across from me at dinner. I'm afraid to look at her face, fear of looking agape....there are two witnesses at all times....so I look down and am looking at her tits!.....not meaning to, but frequent....oh gawd. Did I fool anybody, any of those 3 women?
At home I say nothing. Thank you all for listening to me.

The Deal

Greetings my dear Marnia
In general my Izzy is still not forthcoming (hmmmm). She does not initiate affectionate touch or words. So we have an agreement. We lay together on Tuesday and Thursday nights before sleep and spend at least 20 minutes together at some point on the weekends, taking turns as to who initiates. She doesn't like the formality of the arrangement and lack of spontaneity. I say we can be as spontaneous as we like but I've got some bottom line needs. We negotiated from my position of wanting 5-10 minutes/day of caressing, physically affectionate greetings and partings, laying together every night and sex 3X/week.
I figure, for now, Tuesday, Thursday, Weekend feedings are minimal for my survival (perhaps I've read too much Laurell K Hamilton). We have been orgasmic once every weekend. I am very specific in my requests for affection. I figure on TTHW I can say, "I need you to kiss me. I want you to caress me." Even, "Stroke my head," stuff like that....very direct.....'cause if I don't ask, she won't do it. She says she doesn't like being directed and is just acting. So I accept the TThW limit and tell her we have to practice until it starts working.

Hmmmm...

It'll be interesting to see where it leads. It does strike me that there's nothing to stop her from being spontaneous. I'm sure you'd adapt if her spontaneity covered the same fundamental territory as your schedule. Maybe she'll see that.

Frequent contact IS important. Did you read this thread? Even the tamarin monkeys figure this out: http://www.reuniting.info/node/4211

In fact, a counselor with 40 years of experience confirmed that he, too, thinks attachment behaviors (bonding behaviors) are the best glue. So you're giving Izzy good medicine, even if she doesn't like the taste at the moment.

*big hug*

Self Sabotage

I like to go to Dances of Universal Peace http://www.dancesofuniversalpeace.org/ when the itinerant facilitators come to town once a month. I told my Izzy how the touch and love of that time fills me. She challenges my need for affection and we have fought about my attendance. Yesterday I reminded her I was going. That started a conversation about how needy I am (yeah, so what?).
OK, make me a better offer....20 minutes of love, sex, and affection?
Deal!
Silly me, I took it expecting something different. It started badly with my intent to share a lesson....10 minutes I please you, 10 minutes you please me. A discussion about romance, spontaneity, our lack of skill, and need for practice ensued. 20 minutes later a truce was called and we moved on to me caressing and kissing her. Feeling my love for her, sharing words of love, slow, not too hot, successfully avoiding the Thrill....I entered her because I wanted to be that close and she was ready. It was a lovely 20 minute dance. I could have stayed longer but kept our 20 minute agreement (no orgasm, no problem).
Several times my paranoia arose. I asked, "Where are you? Are you here?" It seemed ok but hope it'll diminish (why would it?). Leaving her room I fell into doubt, fear, and resentment. I was still hungry. It was not enough....not enough kisses from her, words of love from her, caresses from her.
Hotspring's challenge, Where's the love?
Why am I doing this to myself? I've made love to this woman for 36 years. Why on earth should I expect anything different? She hasn't offered to change to please me. Sex with her, her gift to me, is to allow me to worship her with my touch, my words and my kisses. Her gift to me, is to grant me the sight of her nakedness and allow me to enter into her space.
New plan: If I want to be caressed and kissed, I'll ask for it, bargain for it, maybe buy a massage. I can't manipulate her. I will work on appreciating our sex for what it is and just fucking enjoy it.
And, next month I'm going to the dance!

I can tell you why this will

I can tell you why this will never work if you are open to hearing about it. My friend is in a simlar painful situation. By all means though, go to the dance.

Courage is knowing what not to fear.
-Plato

Take her off the pedestal.

Take her off the pedestal. Do what YOU want to do. And never beg anyone for affection or attention. It is not possible for a woman to be attracted to man that behaves like that.

I understand that its a bad cycle to be in. It sounds horrible. I watch my friend do the same thing. I want to smack him upside the head for not seeing it. He will not hear anything about this, he is a professional marriage counselor and he does not feel the need to listen to someone "untrained", so I dont talk to him about this. However, he keeps doing the same things, his wife doesnt respect him, he worships her, he is depressed, and he is not getting his emotional or physical needs met. The way he describes his sexual experiences sound very similar to yours. Unfortunately, a lot of guys have found themselves in a similar situation. It might be out of habit and it just turns into this vicious cycle.

Sorry though, from my brief experiences of being the needy one in relationships, it can really hurt. That is kind of my default too.

Courage is knowing what not to fear.
-Plato

The key is confidence

The key is confidence. I agree with you about begging. It sucks for everyone. But how else do I get the sex I want from a woman who says she could never have sex again and that would be fine with her? I ask and bargain. The other day I was giving her a shoulder rub and asked her to hold my penis as I did it....that kind of stuff. I can do kindness with confidence but romance is real tricky. I read, and it sits on the living room table, "No More Mr. Nice Guy" by Robert Glover. Good stuff, not as angry as I would have thought by reading the blogs at his site. About sex, I thought, "OK, I'll do it myself!"....kind of 2 yr old petulant. I discovered lube and took myself to hand. I understand about self sufficiency and pride but my activities led to more desire for her and a "fuck you" attitude. Not a good combo. The sex goddess Aphrodite is on a pedestal (she would accept no other place, save for bed)...but my Isadora and I have a long and complex relationship that is more democratic than our sex life.
Thanks for the reminder

quality of freedom?

I am curious whether it is possible to distinguish between rationalizing an unacceptable situation and genuinely adjusting one's attitude about what constitutes acceptability. You may be at a unique advantage to understand this question, partially from 36 years of marriage (or togetherness), but especially from the relative infrequency of conventional sex in the relationship.

In my case, I am working to embrace the idea (alternately, to delude myself) that my marriage provides all of the sexual contact that I need. I had developed a strong desire for (1) more frequent sex and (2) greater variety of configurations (keeping things as inexplicit as possible). These two desires merged into (3)--desire for extramarital sex, which I--probably mistakenly--thought would satisfy both (1) and (2). Instead of actually pursuing (3) (though not without getting closer to it than I would like to admit), I began to view all three desires as themselves undesirable. Their existence enslaved my attention, preventing me from fully enjoying the sex that did occur and, perhaps worse, preventing me from concentrating on other, more useful pursuits. I am not yet entirely free from these three desires. Sometimes they appear singly, sometimes all together, to distract my attention to varying degrees, but for the most part I remain tranquil.

This leads to an observation, and then to two succinct questions. It appears that the quality of the freedom that I value has changed. Before, I valued the freedom to do what I desired--the fact that I never realized any of those desires was most distressing. Now, however, I am beginning to value more highly the freedom from desiring what I lack. Since the order of {what I lack} >> {what I have}, the latter attitude seems more prudent.

1) Is this shift simply a psychological defense barrier that I have constructed in order to justify remaining in an unacceptable situation (I believe the answer is 'not at all', but obviously I am not in the ideal position to answer the question)?

2) Does my marriage (or any like it whose partners think the sex frequency is 'reasonable' or 'adequate') meet or exceed some minimum threshold required for sexual fulfillment, or is it possible to be fulfilled in a relationship with any frequency of sex provided that one has the ability to value freedom from desire over freedom to pursue desire?

I pose these questions from my perspective, but they are intended to be asked by anyone for whom they seem relevant.

Sea Saw

I am Mercury to her Aphrodite.....hmmmm....did they ever get together? I don't think she liked fem- boys too much. She went more for the likes of warriors....damnation! Better man-up and go pick a fight (for her honor, of course).......or chop some firewood.

I like teeter-toters (see-saws, is that a regional difference?). Alone, finding that central balance point is cool and proud, but soon boring. Doing it with friends is cool too, for a little while. It's the "finding" that's fun. What's really a gas is coming down hard and catapulting your sister!
(not to worry, she knows how to hold on and enjoys rising up off the seat).

Of course, I know this dance. It's part of a large family of old dances known collectively as the Mind Fuck Jig. It's exhausting. Yet it may be inhuman (inhumane) to be otherwise. Quien sabes? I am in a place, at this moment, of peace and balance. From here that drama is completely irrelevant, and that is way cool. Wonder how long it will be before I get bored and stir things up? In serenity, I am in love and it doesn't matter a bit who's giving. There is no score, there is no error (oh gawd, there's that CScience again).

My Izzy recommended "Radiant Darkness" (for us mythological types) by Emily Whitman. Though juvenile, I really enjoyed it.

Competition and exercise raise testosterone = increased desire. Women are used to not having so much T so a little goes a long ways. A little lively banter could liven things up. Or how about a foot race, Atalanta?

The Key for Me

I recently addressed a similar situation and found that the key was doing some healing work on my own old stuff.

I described the situation to my therapist about how I felt that she was always manipulating me and he asked me what I was doing to manipulater her? That caught me up short. I then slowly came to realize that I was trying to subtly manipulate her. If I just do x, y and z, maybe you will love me. Suddenly I could see how I was giving my power away. If you will just love me the way I want bo be loved, all will be fine. JRsun is right: "It is not possible for a woman to be attracted to man that behaves like that." How can she, it's a hopeless situation. No amount of attention, affection or even just plain old sex that she gives me is ever going to be enough. Until I go back and work on my own stuff, I haven't got a prayer.

So I did. With the therapist's help I went back and explored some of my earliest hurts, my sense of abandonment and feelings of not being loved. How even as a small child I tried to bargain for love. If I'm a good boy, if I just do this, and this, then maybe you will love me. It's a scene I've been re-creating all my life. Holy crap! I also worked on my anger about how I was treated. I really got in touch with how it made me feel powerless. And lo and behold something miraculous has started to happen. All of the sudden, I'm able to love myself and I don't NEED her love the way I used to. Now if I come to her and she can give me love, its frosting on the cake. It's no longer food that I need to survive and food that will never truly leave me feeling full. David Richo says that ideally we should be giving ourselves 75% of the love we need and getting only 25% of it from others. That has always been a very tough concept for me to understand. However, for the first time, I finally see how it might be possible.

Excellent

I'm just finishing "A Symphony in the Brain: The Evolution of the New Brain Wave Biofeedback " by Jim Robbins. A frustrating read but they use Theta consciousness to get to that deeply rooted old gunk.

I understand frosting....and hunger

I think that

When you start to get closer, there's at first a terrible longing for even more. That's where the daily contact comes in. Somehow it helps lead to balance.

So I don't see the situation as hopeless. Balance isn't achieved instantly. I slammed into the same wall, which is why the Exchanges are three weeks long. Smile

*big hug*

Expectation

Gotta check the resentment and anger and passive aggressiveness.....I gotta stop......breathe.....give up on the manipulation and deals.....give up.....stop trying to make it happen.....trust myself....she is not going to do it.
Gawd, why ain't I smarter.

I Give Up

Making breakfast...... I'm thinking about last night's "gimme, gimme, gimme, it's not fair, gimme, gimme, or else, gimme" conversation.

I quit.

I got a heart icon on this thread, but it's sooooo much about addiction and recovery

I have a choice: (it's down to 2, as fixing it with sex is no longer a relevant option (my gawd! does that indicate progress?))
Fill my head with mind fucking shit....or....
Check myself and seek only Love
Ya know.... ya know I've said this a gazillion times, if my brain is working, let's put it to good use. Instead of trying to figure out how to get what I want, try to figure out what the loving way would be.....not the give away to get, but the truly loving way.
AND it's so much nicer to just be present....make breakfast, don't think about last night.....ya know, chop wood, carry water and all that mindfullness stuff.

This means stop trying to get Bonding Behaviors......YIKES!!!!!

I tell ya, a hug is really blurred. I possess not an iota of clarity on that one. That is, I cannot discern a clear duality to the end of the teeter totter that is purely a giving hug. I get soooo much from human contact......oh! oh! oh! Mind Fuck Alert!.....breathe.....it's going to be ok....just love (that includes not only you, but myself as well).....just love

Peace

I think this is the first time I've commented on your thread

... but I'm pretty sure I've read just about everything you've written here. I feel it is inappropriate to criticize the partners of those who contribute to this forum. You know, that whole thing about there being two sides to every story, and all that. But, when I read this today, one word came to my mind about you... long-suffering. This has been going on for a long time, and although you have changed and evolved a great deal, this dynamic in your marriage doesn't seem to change very much at all.

I don't know that this has so much to do with your marriage, as much as it has to do with you, personally. I'm not saying it's your fault. Affection is necessary to human survival, and affection from those we love, and especially our spouses, is necessary for our sanity. Your need for loving contact from your wife is absolutely justified, and resorting to demanding affection seems like a rational step at this point, in my opinion. Although, I don't really see that it is going to achieve the results you are hoping for, because affection that is given on demand is not genuine affection.

Beyond that, I am seeing something in you that I only just recognized in myself... just last week, actually, as I was driving down to San Diego to see that musician whose song I posted on TA's thread. Insights come out of nowhere sometimes, and this one was a whopper! Here it is: I don't know how to move beyond my LONGING for affection. In fact, I am addicted to the LONGING. I don't even know what I would do at this point if that longing was satisfied, and I actually received the affection I crave, from someone that I desired it from. I have developed no plan for that. Do you have a plan for that, I wonder? I mean, is there a part of you that possibly needs your wife to deny you, so that you can stay in this pattern?

I found myself in a very intriguing situation recently, in which one of my professors began to take a very obvious interest in me, beyond the realm of student-teacher relations, if you know what I mean. It was entirely unexpected, and quickly threw me off my center. I mean, this man is brilliant, gorgeous, exotic, and crazy... all the things that can make woman like me go wild. I could see the possibility of completely losing myself in him, just submitting to that drug that is desire, and never coming back. The situation was growing more intense over a period of about four weeks... or I should say the energy between us was growing in intensity, because there was no discussion about it. I could just sense it escalating. It escalated to a point last week, however, when he erupted in class, personally directed at me, for no reason whatsoever. I'm the best student in that class, and he knows it! He quickly began trying to make up for it, but something had shifted, by necessity, I think, and I don't think it is going to shift back.

Obviously, this situation has nothing on a decades-long marriage. It is not profound in the big picture, but only in my little world. But, I left that day knowing that I had fallen into a trap, and even though the trap was thrilling, I know that traps are really not good for me. I do this thing now where I pray... it's new for me... when I know that I am stuck in a pattern, an addictive pattern, and I know that I might not be able to pull myself out by own will, because my will in these situations is often weak. In my situation, it goes something like this:

God, I want this man (or this thing, or this situation), but there is a higher part of me that knows that it might not be good for me. If that is the case, if his intentions towards me (or if this thing is not right for me) are not pure and based on what is best for us both, then I want this to end, even though I know it will hurt if it does. I will accept the pain that comes with this loss, because I know there is something ahead that is better for me.

And goddammit, it fucking works. Every time. I went to class yesterday, and it was as though nothing had happened. His attitude towards me was completely professional. Kind, but professional. And you know what, AC? I was cursing the high heavens! I asked to have my drug taken away, and it was taken... and it sucks. I want it back, but I also want to get on with my life, and not be held back by incessant longings. The longings are the traps I create for myself, because I am looking to have them fulfilled in the wrong places. That is my addiction.

I will not claim to have any answers for your marriage. But, I believe that you deserve the love you crave, and I'm not always certain that you will find it in your marriage, by no fault of yours or Izzy's. There are no head games you can play with your wife to manipulate her into giving you what you crave. She is your wife, and she knows you better than that. My hope for you is that you have the courage and strength to see how this situation is keeping you from attaining the same kind of love that you have to give, and to do whatever is necessary to overcome those obstacles, whatever that means for you.

As for me, I have a test to study for, for the above mentioned class, so I better do that now.

All my love,

Discordia

"God, I want this man (or

"God, I want this man (or this thing, or this situation), but there is a higher part of me that knows that it might not be good for me. If that is the case, if his intentions towards me (or if this thing is not right for me) are not pure and based on what is best for us both, then I want this to end, even though I know it will hurt if it does. I will accept the pain that comes with this loss, because I know there is something ahead that is better for me."

That sounds powerful. I am addicted to the cravings for affection as well. Affection should be spontaneous and a by-product/support of a healthy emotional fulfilling relationship. I also put the cart before the horse and am always looking for that hit. I am also teaching a class and I need to refrain from hitting on my students, so this prayer might work for me too.

Courage is knowing what not to fear.
-Plato

Yes, it has been really effective

I started practicing this over the summer, in a concerted effort to once-and-for-all eliminate a few relationships that had been interfering with my growth. When it comes to eliminating romantic interferences (and I mean those that are clearly not a good idea), it is really hard. Once the agreement is made that I will accept the loss, and move on, I really do feel bound to it, and there is always an emptiness once it's done. I'm feeling that right now, as a matter of fact. Drained and empty, and trying to study!

I have a new found appreciation, though, for the self-restraint that male professors have to exercise in their jobs on college campuses. It's also the same for you and I, being older than most of the students, more experienced, but still not old enough where it would be completely inappropriate to date them. It actually takes effort not to manipulate those situations sometimes, to get "that hit." Living consciously can be a real pain in the ass!

Longing

What a beautiful essay on "longing". Oh, I know I'm hooked on that one....Yearning is so sweet. When I was dating, I soon got bored with the easy girls who liked me. I was a real ass. Wish I had known Marnia's work then. Now I have crushes on younger women from time to time. I've learned to enjoy it and let it pass. To bad he had to be a jerk to seperate.
Today has been real good. I'm in reset mode. I am grateful that I have eyes that can see the beauty of our world. Hands that delight in touch. A mind that is creative and can solve problems. A voice with speech, that sometimes makes sense. Ears to hear. Feet that take me where I want to go. A heart that loves. Most of the other is bullshit. I quit trying. I quit the mind self abuse. What this means for our marriage, I don't know.
Thank you so much for the time you took to write
te amo

I am looking forward to the

I am looking forward to the day when you can write about love fulfilled, instead of love longed for. I am looking forward to doing that myself, one of these days.

Oh, and just to be clear, he is not that much older than me. This is not a Lolita situation! It's possible that he thinks it is, though, because I look a bit younger than I am. It's funny, because for the last four years, I've been swimming in a sea of eligible early 20-somethings, and in my last semester, I managed to get myself in two classes with two most attractive, single, and age-appropriate instructors in my department. And there's still two months to go, so who knows? Maybe my liberal arts education will actually pay off in some kind of practical way here. It remains to be seen.

Maybe you can go in wearing

Maybe you can go in wearing a schoolgirl outfit for halloween? I would if I could, I might even.

Does your department have bbqs and things? Professors can have pretty informal parties with their grad students. Or, maybe you could put a note under his door! I found out a girl student had been talking about me outside of class today, so I am going to approach it carefully. You are right though, being in between a student and a staff member is a difficult place to be in. The students look at me and give me the respect of a staff member, but Im still a young buck ready to cause trouble for myself.

Good for you for exercising caution, but who knows, hunk professor might have an extra credit assignment for you!

Courage is knowing what not to fear.
-Plato

Man, you are just full of

Man, you are just full of good ideas. I probably should have come to you at the beginning of this whole thing.

As it turns out, I might have to seduce him. I'm only half way through his study guide for the exam tomorrow, and I'm so tired, I have double vision. I guess there's more than one way to get an A, huh?

I can't believe I just said that.

You are so insightful.

I've had a similar experience recently. I found myself falling for someone and stepping into a role of majorly helping them out in order to prove my worthiness. All the while not even having a clue if there was even a possibility of mutual feelings. So, I did something bold and wrote her an email. It was completely open and honest. I left nothing out, even indicating that I was possibly falling into an unhealthy pattern that I have. She responded openly and honestly that her feelings were not there for me and although broken up with her previous boyfriend, she was still seeing him. Actually, she was even open about how her continuing to see him may be unhealthy. While it was initially disheartening, I could see that all the fantasy was dispelled and what I was left with was the reality that I had deepened my friendship with her. Now, I am not inclined to be unbalanced in my dealings with her.

Like so many things in life, we humans can get attached more to the dream of something rather than the reality. D, you have done some great sharing here about how to avoid it with sending out the perfect prayer. I will try that the next time.

AC, I was married for 16 years and know the feeling of being denied affection very well. I was never more alone than lying in bed next to a partner who didn't even want me touching her. My heart goes out to you and I honor you for all you are doing to support yourself and I wish you luck in creating the juicy relationship you deserve!

I know I've asked this question before,

but would she make a three-week experiment...with no compromise on the orgasm front? Would you? Wink I know it's hard to believe that compromise can be a problem, but for some of use a period of consistency, WITH daily affection, can "reboot" the system and reset mutual perception.

I know you've tried everything else, but maybe if you use a fixed program with a definite END, and let her pick the bonding behaviors of her choice for the first week...and then take turns...you'd see some movement.

I'm telling you, as much as you like our hot female orgasms, they don't necessarily bring out the best in us...and the shift is usually delayed. (p. 178 in Cupid or here: http://www.reuniting.info/lazy_way_to_stay_in_love)

Reminder: if you try this, no masturbation on the side for the 3 weeks. She might have forgotten that part. Wink

Thanks Marnia

The 3 week thing has been on the table for over a year. It ain't gonna happen. Or last orgasm was 9 days ago...so a tricky time now.
Ya know, I'm gonna love when I can and really look for other ways to feed my hunger. You've got a good list. I've got to stop trying to control things.
All that love and support you give....right back atchya

Day 3

Starting day 3 of mindfullness and I'm liking it. A lot of crap just disappears when I simply focus on being present. Even switching the mind fuck to loving thoughts fades in comparison to just paying attention. Thank you Anat Baniel and Moshe Feldenfrais and all the others who teach awareness.

Just finished "A Symphony in the Brain: The Evolution of the New Brain Wave Biofeedback" by Jim Robbins Using Neurofeedback to heal addiction, nice. You can play Pac Man or watch your favorite movie (watch out boys and girls, not that favorite movie) while rewiring your brain...awesome! http://www.eeginfo.com/shop/product_info.php/products_id/35
Anybody tried it?
This is one way to influence the brain....bonding behaviors is another...wire me up, let's do some karezza, and check out the waves!

Sappho

[quote=Sappho]Some say a squadron of horse
Some, infantry
Some, ships
Are the lovliest thing on this black earth.
But I say
It's what you desire.[/quote]from The Soul of Sex

Desire Impostor

[quote]...On top of being disappointed by a refusal, we could feel humiliated for having asked at all. As we see it, the other person is in control of what we are about to feel, and the only remedy for this alarming state of affairs is to get control over the other person.
As our minds fill up with strategy, the desire itself fades into past tense. When we finally get around to stating it, we are describing our memory of a desire that, in the moment, we do not feel....
...You might even say that you found someone’s desire for you repellant.
Take a closer look at such episodes. My guess is that what put you off was not the desire, but whatever your pursuer was doing instead of desiring. They were likely intent on controlling your response. They tried to flatter you, or bully you, or exploit some vulnerability in you. Maybe they were bombastic and boastful about their desire, or maybe they were apologetic about it. Maybe they presented it as a sort of affliction upon which you were meant to take pity. One way or another, what you felt coming from them was anxiety, not desire.

Pure desire is as radiant and life-giving as the sun. It is the life force: how everything living came to be, and sustains its life. To feel anything but wonderful when the life force shines on you is impossible. You could no more be repelled by it than a fish is repelled by water.

If something that calls itself desire makes you want to run like hell in the opposite direction, you have encountered an impostor....[/quote]

http://www.onetaste.us/blog5/2011/08/how-to-speak-your-desire-not-its-im...

Now

that I have no libido, she does have the lead. She came to my bed this morning and we had a nice cuddle. She told me she'd been angry at me for something that happened 3 weeks ago but now has forgotten what it was and figured it was time to give it up. I was clueless. I'm too busy running my own program.
I'm still liking the lack of heat. I was ready and open thhis morning to anything that might happen. It was so nice and calm. Tonight she is wearing a sexy dress. It's lovely and I am clean shaven, but I am not going to try to make anything happen. I have no agenda.
Bonding behaviors (by me) are limited to being attentive when she speaks, quick kisses of greeting, and offering help. I'm starting to think that the oogling, ass grabbing, and lewd comments aren't the compliments I thought they were (duh, did anybody here tell me that?). With no libido, I'm seeing her world a little clearer.
I'm off to ask her if she wants the second lesson in Tantra (TOfW)
I love that you are dancing

Yep

We're going to a party with a live band tonight. Dancing will be involved.
She said "no" to the second lesson