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Hi forum members!

I had a short email conversation with Marnia recently. She asked me to post it here... So here goes.

Arnold

Hi Marnia,

Thanks so much for your book. It has shed a great deal of light on my
struggles and given me hope of a way out.

The best community amongst the people I feel spiritually close to (Osho
sannyasins) is in and north of Montreal Quebec Canada. I am doing what I can to get closer to them (I currently live in BC Canada).
Have there ever been translations of "Peace Between the Sheets" into
French?

Cheers,

Arnold

---- Begin Original Message ----
From: Marnia Robinson

Hi Arnold,

Thanks for the kind words. Part of the book has been translated into
French (See
http://www.reuniting.info/peace_between_the_sheets/french_translation),
but we need to find a publisher first, so the translator can be
compensated before he/she does any more. If you have any suggestions....

I have a lot of sannyasin friends, and I, too, like their humor and
refreshing attitude toward sex. Did you see this article at our site? It
has some lovely Osho quotes.
http://www.reuniting.info/wisdom/sannyasin_tantra_osho

The one point I think they often miss is the costs of orgasm in terms of
relationship harmony. Apparently Osho himself was quite promiscuous
(Lots of juicy history in this one:
http://www.reuniting.info/wisdom/quest_for_spiritual_orgasm_winn), so
maybe he didn't see the problem, even though he saw the solution. Wink

Warm regards,
Marnia

Arnold wrote:
Hi Marnia,

Thanks for writing and letting me know about the french parts of Peace and the Karezza method.

Thanks too for directing me to the article on sannyasin tantra. It touched me. I feel a deep connection with Osho and his words generally bring that feeling up to my awareness. I liked Vibha's words very much too.

I agree that sannyasins are not always so aware. I've seen what I would call "good" communities and "not so good" communities amongst people who call themselves "friends of Osho". I think some of your Osho quotes show Osho's understanding very well. One of the things I appreciated about Osho when he was speaking was the permission he gave us to really screw up. And we did it! And we learnt. And we're still at it, whoever "we" are.

The stuff around Osho's sex life bothered me. I couldn't feel the connection I usually feel with him. It seemed to be more of the sensationalistic stuff that I found so wierd coming from the media when I was on the ranch in Oregon. I have no idea what his sex life was like. Even the quote about wanting to find "jewish girls who like to fuck" (in Winn's article) could easily have been taken out of context and/or distorted. My experience of him was, (and still is) at a feeling level, generally of a tremendous love and playfulness. One of my favorite Osho quotes is: "My sexual ethic is love". It is certainly what I have experienced around him and fits well with what I find important myself.

I'm not sure that he didn't see the problem. He was talking to a vast audience and created connections from a vast array of problems to his one solution in my understanding. Focussing too much on problems tends to have a way of getting caught in them in my experience. He certainly didn't phrase things the way you do. The science wasn't up to the standard it is now. I really like the information you've included in your work. The scientific slant to it is very valuable to me. I'm sure Osho would have appreciated it too, had he had the chance to read it. He seemed to me to be a fan of the scientific method. I, for one, would have certainly sent "Peace" his way for him to look at.

That said, I really like your emphasis on healing. I'm very grateful for it. It's very healing for me and has given me a language to share with people who don't share my connection with Osho at all. It has also shown me in a very vivid way how women avoid healing. That is a major turn in my life having become aware in the last couple of years of childhood sexual abuse coming from my mother in quite subtle yet very powerful and very toxic ways. That wound has left me very isolated and struggling with my health and finances in a big way.

I also like what I've read (and experimented with as much as possible) about your approach. I like the very slow very gentle aspect of it very much. I would like very much to find a "sweetheart" who wants to share a deeply healing connection with me. I've lost faith in that happening in this community and struggle with finding a way to let go of attractions that I know won't be good for me while I work towards getting to the Osho community in Quebec (see http://www3.sympatico.ca/l.dagenais/auberg/) where the interest in consciousness and a gentle, loving, playfulness is much stronger in my experience.

Thanks for your help.

Much Love to you.

Arnold

Marnia wrote:

Thanks for your beautiful letter, Arnold.

Vibha had a very similar impression of Osho. I, too, wish I could have run our material past Osho, as I think he would have liked it, too. I've thought about him a lot. In fact, I once asked my I Ching about him, since the many Rolls Royce's, etc. just didn't "feel right" to me. It said he was still experiencing a sense of lack. Maybe, but I'm sure he was experiencing a lot smaller sense of lack than the rest of us! But perhaps he was still learning things, too. In any case, I value his huge contribution. How can we use sex for a sacred purpose if we don't speak about it and experiment with it? The people he spoke to have done a great job of "ripping the lid off" of sex so we could look inside and see what we all brought with us and how it can be used for a higher purpose. They are all over the planet now, still planting seeds. Even though I never met him, I feel like I'm part of that same team.

I wouldn't think Michael Winn would write sensationalist stuff about Osho out of spite. He strikes me as one of the most sincere seekers in the sacred sexuality community. I think he was just honestly reporting his experience with no ax to grind (since his own adventure was not so different). But who knows? In any case, I'm sure Osho was learning as he went along, too, and I think Winn met him early on.

Your letter is so excellent that I wonder if you would post it, or some part of it, on the Reuniting forum. It takes a minute to register, which is a pain in the butt (It's the only way we can cut down on hordes of Russian spammers selling God-knows-what. Wink ). It might allow you to meet others of like mind. http://www.reuniting.info/forum/ No problem if you don't want to fool with this. It was just a thought. You could post under "Related Traditions." All the current users will see it.

I'd also be happy to introduce you to Vibha by cyberspace if you like. I'm not sure where she is, but I have an email address for her.

Thanks for your remarks about the emphasis on healing at our site. Few people comment on this, but it's the key concept in a way. If we would put our attention on healing each other, we would find we healed, too. As I say in my book, we're all wilted plants. A good mutual watering is just what's called for! Remember, our parents COULDN'T have gotten it right. They were even more in the dark than we are. I'm sure your mother did the best she was able to, even if it wasn't too impressive.

I wish you the ideal partner. By the way, I have a Canadian friend who was part of the Osho community (to some degree) in Montreal. Should I put you in touch with her? She now lives at Harbin Hot Springs in Middletown, CA. It's a resort/community. You might think about going there if the cold ever gets to you.

A big hug,
Marnia

Hi Marnia,

I have a few more things to add that came to mind as I read your letter. I can understand your concern about the Rolls Royces Osho had. When I arrived on the ranch in Oct. 1985, he had 99 at his disposal even though they were formally owned by the foundation. I saw many things that I found disturbing. There were guns, a pretty intense security check, checkpoints, and a fence at the entrance. All reminded me of my childhood in the military even though the feeling was completely different. At the time, I was determined to check it out in spite of my concerns and gave the place 24 hours before I would leave. On sitting with Osho during discourse in Rajneesh Mandir, it became very clear to me that he was the guy I was looking for. So, inside myself, I said to Osho, "I don't understand the crazy stuff that's going on around you, but I'm very clear that you are the person I want to connect with." So I stayed. The ranch was over and Osho back in India in less than a month. I had become a sannyasin. I watched 5 truckloads of Rolls Royces leave on a snowy December day that year.

There are many stories around those cars. Osho seemed to think of them as a delightful joke. He had a remarkable sense of humour. My understanding is that they started as a way to convince bankers to give the ashram loans in Pune 1 in the late 1970's in India. One thing for sure, is that they shattered many people's ideas of how a spiritual man should behave. He shattered alot of those illusions in many ways.

I sometimes think it was one of many devices he used to keep the less than fully committed away. I arrived just after the phase where we were asked to wear red, a mala, and change names before taking sannyas. I did them all anyway because I wanted to. All of these devices glued us together very intensely and at the same time kept the spiritual tourists out. Osho's many embarrassing statements and activities certainly challenged us all many times too.

I still feel a certain wariness around talking to everyday people about my connection with Osho (hence my use of two names). It's hard to describe why I would be so keen on such an unusual man and such an intangible path. When you strip away any of the few external trappings to that connection, it is simply a deep love affair and defies explanation. I certainly feel it and that I can't deny.

I also noticed that you came to my mother's defense quite quickly when I mentioned the sexual abuse I have become aware of. I have seen this pattern so often, it is pretty much predictable. What is it that makes mothers so easily excused of the consequences of their actions on their own children? I am very aware that she was and still is incapable of consciousness and/or healing at the emotional and sexual levels. I no longer expect it and am looking for people who are capable of it. It's been a mighty rough struggle to figure out what the wound was to begin with (the abuse was quite subtle) and then at least two years to settle with its reality. I also realize that my responsibility was my choice to be born through her at the time I was born. Perhaps we squirm when we are faced with a pain of that depth. I can't squirm any more, it's such a real part of my life. Perhaps the terror is too great to face.

The last joke Osho ever told was about this. If you want I'll write it down. It's a long one, so it may take a while.

Lots of love to you,

Arnold

Sure, let's hear the joke

I don't think mothers are a special case, by the way. I think *everyone* deserves to be forgiven. (Fathers, too.) Without a clear understanding of how our primitive brain pushes us around for its own ends, making us defensive (and sometimes aggressive) toward those we should love most, we are all bound to do things we will wish we had not.

This is not to make light of your wound or the courage it has taken to confront and heal it. You have my sincere sympathy. I simply mean to suggest that until we are all better educated we will tend to make similar errors, even while trying to do our best.

"If you do what you've always done, you'll get what you've always gotten." And the human race has been following its reward circuitry around blindly in the way it manages its sexual energy for a very long time. Without inner balance, we tend to create chaos in many areas of our lives, even parenting.

Thanks for sharing your Osho experience.

Forgiveness and laughter

Hi Marnia!

I found the joke! It was on a website in Holland. That way I don't have to copy it from the joke book I have. I'll post it at the end of my reply.

The forgiveness piece is a tricky one for me. I find it very easy to "forgive" someone else and in so doing leave things exactly as they are. Hence learning nothing and repressing the wound one more time. To do that, in my case, is to prevent my own healing and do my mother even more damage by self-destructing as I am very prone to doing. I call it "sweeping things under the carpet". It's basically how my birth family works with emotional and sexual trauma of any kind. Acceptance is an easier word for me. Accepting the pain (and feeling safe enough to do that) is a big part of my journey in my understanding. Accepting the part of me that is capable of taking care of myself at this level is another big part of it and highly elusive in my experience.

I agree with you that we have been behaving unconsciously with sex energy for a very long time. The urge to reproduce is a strong one and I certainly fall into that trap as well. I'm sure my mother was stuck in it too although exactly how is mostly guesswork as communication only goes so far with her. I can imagine that opportunities for a beautiful, intelligent and generally caring woman like she was (and still is) to fully embrace herself at all levels in the late 50's when she got married (to a military officer) were decidedly slim. Rather than face that frustration she chose to follow the path 99.9% of women were following at that time. I suspect sexual abuse in her own childhood, yet have no confirmation from anyone about it. The choice to reproduce in that sexual/emotional environment pretty much guarantees problems in the kids at that level. I was in a birth order position, a gender, and birth time more or less set up to take the brunt of it.

For me to fully heal I'm going to need to be around people who understand and support what I'm doing. I don't have that here. "Sweeping things under the carpet" would have me stop looking for places where I can continue to do that. That would place me solidly on a path of self-destruction. It's very easy for me to confuse that with forgiveness as most people around here seem to think that's what forgiveness is. I see potential for a deeper healing in the Montreal Osho crowd. I also see potential in people who are interested in your book and understand what you are saying. I'm finding that to be quite rare.

I hope this reply isn't too elaborate for you. I would like to create as many connections as possible with people who have interests like yours. It's important for me to be as open as I can and stand up for my understanding. There is something about the sexual victimization of boys by their mothers that challenges every single cultural taboo I can think of. Standing up to them in the service of healing is alot of work and often very subtle stuff.

I'm glad for the opportunity to share with you. It's rare that I can do that at this level with people who don't share my connection with Osho. (It's rare even with people who I do share that connection with!) Thanks for the opportunity to connect with you and your friends.

Here's the joke :) Enjoy!

Love Arnold

On a foggy morning in Vienna, Austria, the two famous psychoanalysts, Doctor Sigfried Mind, and Doctor Krazy Karl Kong, meet in the little Brown Danube Cafe.
Over a table set with coffee and cream cakes, Doctor Kong suddenly jumps up, grabs Sigfried by the neck, and shakes him.
"We must go this time!" shouts Karl. "We have tried six times already! We must go to the pyramids in Egypt to see the mummies!"
"MUMMIES?" screeches Sigfried, collapsing into the cream cakes in a dead faint.
Doctor Kong pours coffee on Doctor Mind's head until he recovers.
"Come on, Mind," cries Doctor Kong, slapping him across the face. "We can do it! We have to explore this mystery of death!"
"DEATH?" screeches Mind, and he faints again into the plate of cream cakes.
Half an hour later, at the Vienna airport, Doctor Krazy Karl Kong is dragging Doctor Sigfried Mind by the collar onto the plane bound for Cairo.
"Come on, Mind!" cries Krazy Kong, huffing and puffing. "We have made it this far, we have got to see those mummies!"
"MUMMIES?" screeches Sigfried, falling in a faint on top of Nellie Knickers, the stewardess.
Kong and Nellie drag Mind to his seat, and strap him down. The plane takes off, and three hours later, arrives in the Land of the Pyramids. Kong carries the babbling Doctor Mind to the herd of rented camels, which are waiting to take them to the pharaohs' tombs.
Doctor Kong shouts out to their guide, Abdul Babul, "Take us to the mummies!"
"MUMMIES?" screeches Mind, fainting and falling straight off his camel, nose first, into a sand dune.
Two days later, the famous psychoanalysts and their camels arrive at the huge pyramids. Doctor Kong jumps down, lights a torch, grabs Doctor Mind by the collar, and starts dragging him into the dark, mysterious crypts.
Suddenly, in the darkness, Doctor Kong trips over something.
"What is that?" screeches Mind.
"Ah! It is alright -- it is only a dead cat!" exclaims Doctor Kong.
"DEATH!" screeches Mind. And he falls over in a cold faint.
"Pull yourself together, Doctor!" shouts Kong. "We are almost there!"
And Kong grabs Sigfried by the shoe, and drags him feet first towards a huge golden coffin. "Stand up!" cries Doctor Kong, propping Mind up against the wall, and handing him the burning torch.
Then Krazy Karl Kong bends over and lifts back the heavy, creaking coffin lid. The lid falls to the ground with a loud crash, and when the dust clears, Doctor Kong is left standing with his mouth wide open, gazing at the spooky sight before his eyes.
He turns and grabs the frozen Doctor Mind by the collar and pulls his face down into the coffin.
"There!" shouts Kong, in triumph. "This is a MUMMY!"
"MUMMY?" screeches Sigfried. But he just stares in disbelief, with his eyes popping out.
"MUMMY?" he screeches again. "Hey, this looks more like daddy!"

This was Osho's last joke.

Ha ha!

Thanks for sharing your joke.

Your remarks also made me reflect on what I mean when I think about forgiveness.

For me the key to healing any pain is, when possible, moving toward inner balance, as that always clears perception. My preferred method is controlled intercourse and playful mutual affection, as you know. Failing that, meditation and journaling (with or without an oracle) often work.

But there is another step (beyond controlled intercourse), and in my view it is far easier the more centered one feels. That step is to gain a new perspective on my painful circumstances, whatever the issue is.

For example, if a relative acts like a jerk for years, and one day I realize that he was actually an alcoholic, it shifts my whole perception of his behavior. It becomes possible to imagine him as he might have been without the influence of alcohol. There's a recognition that I didn't see much of the real him, and that the real him is still a shiny spirit that merely got muddy (and consequently behaved badly) while playing around in matter.

At that point, forgiveness seems perfectly logical. I WANT everyone, including myself, to be forgiven for the errors we have all committed during our "matter adventures." It doesn't feel like this is a desire to sweep anything under the carpet. In fact, it makes it easy to acknowledge exactly how "muddy" the person behaved...but to see such behavior as a natural consequence of earth-plane living (with reward circuitry trying its hardest to push us toward "getting" rather than "giving/healing").

Once when I was agonizing over a deep hurt, and repeating to myself, "HOW could this person behave this way toward another person?" I read an insight that I have found to be very helpful.

"There are more pearls of wisdom to be discovered in the sea of insight than in the trash can of old conditioning."

I realized that, sure enough, I had been digging through the "trash can," convinced that if I just examined my pain thoroughly enough I would magically feel better. I also seemed to get some sort of grim satisfaction out of it on some level.

So, just to test the theory, I asked for insight about my pain. Then I picked three of my favorite spiritual books from a nearby shelf, flipped each one open at random and put them face down in front of me. Then I picked each one up and read the first paragraph that my eyes landed on. It was amazing. Each of the "messages" was very similar. Each of them, I think, said something about needing to love myself more. Best of all, they "worked." I stopped feeling like a victim and went on to employ the insight with excellent results. I would never have thought to work on my self love (or whatever the insight was) if I had continued to ask my same painful questions over and over, looking for an answer.

Since then, when something hurts, and I realize I'm going around and around the "four corners of the box" and none of my logic is easing the pain, I make it a point to go "outside" the box, by asking for insight. Almost always an insight comes that allows me to see the situation differently, from a larger perspective. Sometimes it seems to have no direct connection to the problem.

Amazingly, this process usually eases the pain. Examples of insights might be that I realize that all of humanity is acting in less than ideal ways because of the influence of our reward circuitry. Or perhaps I realize that I, too, might have made the same error as the person I'm upset with if I had been in their shoes, etc. Or I might see that they are a mirror for some weakness of my own. Or....

In the end, if I'm willing to see things differently, I can ease my suffering enormously. As one of my favorite spiritual books says, "We can either choose to be right, or happy." More and more, I choose to be happy, even if it means I have to see a problem differently (that is, without the "grim satisfaction" I mentioned above).

When something upsets me my first request now tends to be, "heal my perception of this painful matter so I can be happy." I know that only by seeing it differently can I let the pain go, so I direct my efforts there with as little delay as possible. To me, this is not a matter of "sweeping." It's a matter of acknowledging exactly what hurts and then asking to see it differently. If it's a big issue, I may have to chip away at it with a series of healing insights.

I also acknowledge that this process is easier when one is not on one's own. However, I've used it when single, too, with good results. I'm not sure why I feel the urge to babble on about this, but since it's all here, I guess I'll post it. Smile

Babble On Dear Sister

What a wonderful piece on forgiveness. Thanks Arnold for getting me over here. I ran from corner to corner in my box for a looooooong time. Getting sober, here, opened my eyes and made healing possible. My Izzy has been a problem for 30 years. Now that I have a new perspective of her and continue to focus on my healing, there is no problem, puzzles perhaps. If I see it as a problem then I need to look again at how I'm thinking about it.

Thanks

Hi Marnia,

Thanks for sharing your way. I use Zen Tarot, the Tao Oracle and Rajneesh neo-Tarot to shift my thinking sometimes. On this particular issue, I find it difficult to shift much without connecting with the right people because it has such a strong component of physical nuturing to it. I have connected with a group of Quantum touch people here and have taught it myself to friends. Still there's a limit to what I can feel safe being and expressing here. So pursuing another place to live seems best right now. Even considering taking off, is a big change for me. In my youth, it was pretty much impossible to get distance my birth family, partly for the normal reasons and partly because being a military family we moved alot. The sense of loyalty to the group and isolation from others was particularly strong for me.

Thanks for your help!

Anything else you want to know about my experience of Osho?

Love

Arnold

PS: Glad you liked the joke. I think it was Osho's longest joke too. I see much in it.

Forgiveness

Hi Marnia,

I thought of something around the topic of forgiveness that I'd like to share with you. It's been helpful in gaining clarity for me and avoiding the trap of sweeping things under the carpet.

Alice Miller has written alot on the topic of child abuse and is often very critical of the general use of forgiveness in healing of childhood abuse. She points very clearly to the role of ideology and pedagogy in inflicting these wounds. Her stuff seems caustic at first but the more I read it, the more I realized she's on to something. It's been helpful to me in identifying the hurt and framing it in a realistic light, rather than pretending there was no hurt at all when in fact much of my life makes it quite obvious that there are some glaring voids.

Take a look at http://www.alice-miller.com/articles_en.php?lang=en&nid=48&grp=11 and let me know what you think!

Cheers,

Arnold

Hi Arnold

First let me say that I think your desire to connect with others is very healthy, and quite likely the result of thinking "outside of the box."

Second, I agree with Alice Miller in many respects.

And yet I still think that healing comes from seeing things differently. If that means a person gets really, really angry for a time as part of the healing, so be it. I also think that the angry phase is a phase, and that one can keep seeking the key insights for healing until one is at peace with a past hurt. For example, how many of us know what WE got up to in a past life??? I find that concept a good reminder when I feel like a victim.

I'm not suggesting that anyone rush the process. I'm sorry if I gave you that impression.

Past lives

Hi Marnia,

Thanks for your thoughts. It's good to hear them on such subtle and delicate (and yet loaded) stuff. In the last couple of days I've been pondering the forgiveness stuff myself and wondering, "Who am I angry at now?". I tend to repress my own anger intensely and yet it drives much of my behaviour. Clearly, it's not my mother any more. I sense a stonger sense of sadness and tragedy in that dynamic than anger at her. She was overwhelmed and unsupported in many ways. It's more at entire communities and particularly the one I live in. Finding ways to move through that is tricky. Fortunately I am connected via the internet to the community in Quebec (and this one through you) and am gradually feeling a sense of support at a sexual/emotional level. It helps me become stronger and more vocal here without worrying about being targeted as a trouble maker. I can let them live with their stuff as I am working on getting myself surrounded by people who truly have an interest in healing.

Your comment about past-lives intrigued me. I did have a very vivid past life memory recall (while doing hypnotherapy a while ago) that fits the situation very closely. In that life I was the leader of a very beautiful celtic community and felt highly responsible for its well being. I sensed a huge sense of failure when we were all butchered by an invading people from the south. Perhaps my current anger is my way of slowly putting the responsibility for my peoples well being back where it belongs! ie: with them.

Love ya lots!

Thanks for your help

Arnold

We welcome your posts

I hear you. I sometimes feel a deep sense of sadness at all the senseless misery and slaughter in humanity's group adventure. Hopefully, it really IS like a play that doesn't affect Reality, or our destiny as immortal, multi-dimensional spirit beings.

That being said, as one of my favorite spiritual books puts it, "Delay (meaning our continual decision to hang around in matter lifetime after lifetime, rather than meet the conditions for spiritual awakening) does not matter in eternity, but it is tragic in time." In other words, while our perception is limited to the physical plane, and we remain unable to experience our larger Selves much if at all, it all looks tragic indeed.

Then I remind myself that maybe these esoteric sources are right. They insist we are making ourselves spiritually blind by constantly lowering our vibration due to the way we use sex (the withdrawal period can make us feel vulnerable, defensive, emotionally alienated from others, selfish, needy, apathetic, self-indulgent...you name it...due to the neurochemically-induced sense of lack - and then we ACT on our distorted feelings).

If that is, indeed, the case, then we can damn well fix it ourselves, too. At about this point in my reflections I feel more hopeful. Smile

In any case, I definitely know that I've had enough lifetimes of this nonsense, even if it turns out that it is only a painful drama, a 3-D illusion of sorts.

Thanks

Hi Marnia,

I hear you on that one. I was talking with a friend out east a while ago and said, "You know, this misery trip is getting old". Time to try something new! Like what's in your book, Marnia. :)

I hope I find a way to get physically close to people who are willing to experiment. My "Desperado, out riding fences" trip is getting old too.

Lots of love to you,

Arnold

Right

We all have excellent reasons for being uneasy about the opposite sex...but that won't get the healing done.

xx--M

I'd also like to read "Peace

I'd also like to read "Peace Between the Sheets" in French and I'm sorry to see there's no publisher willing to pay for this to happen. If I'd have the time I'd make it my project to translate the rest of the book myself but unfortunately I have too much going on right now.
___________

2 cents on forgiveness

What's with the dates in this thread? I don't want to be responding to something ancient... but just in case this really is from last month and not years ago, I wanted to give my 2 cents on forgiveness, cuz it's something I've pondered very intensely lately. I too am carrying anger toward my parents, and some of it has to do with sexual molestation from my father. I too heard how I must forgive in order to heal, and though I agree with that, I disagree with the way it's often presented. I agree with Arnold that it can be used to sweep things under the rug. In fact, a lot of the new age or lightworker teachings seems to be presented that way a lot, and I believe that can do a lot of harm. (It can do good too, I suppose. I mean, if someone's not ready to face their problems but can follow the teachings of love and light, why not let them cultivate joyousness?)

In my case, I found that I just could not forgive. A few times I thought I had, but then a deeper level of anger came up after a few months. It was a process, and I let myself take the time I needed. I went through different levels of forgiveness, backslided into anger, forgave again, and then, last year found myself in a place of strong anger again, almost as strong as it ever was.

In my case, I think the anger and the inability to forgive was important. Is important, actually, as my journey continues, despite a recent powerful experience where I forgave at a level far deeper than before.

Anger is seen as something negative, and it sure can be. However, in some cases, it might be a person's way to call them back to integrity when another part of them refuses to. Anger arises due to a threat, often when someone crosses one of our boundaries that should not be crossed. Other times, it's about frustration at things being wrong that cannot be changed, yet the person needs them to. In both these cases, the anger is pointing at something that needs to be fixed and is providing massive amounts of energy that if channelled correctly can fuel a change that might be too difficult otherwise. Only after this change was I then open to all the wonderful work Marnia describes.

(P.S. From what I've read in The Book of Secrets, I like Osho a whole heck of a lot too. This community sounds like a place I'd like to visit, as I'm looking for kindreds too, those who're on the healing path, committed, even if it's painful. It's shadow work, and for whatever reason, that's a strong component of my spirituality. For me, it just seems right to heal the ego before destroying it. Otherwise, it might still have hooks in me, even if I'm enlightened.)

AMEN !

"...it just seems right to heal the ego before destroying it."

I really like this line! Thanks for the 2 cents!

Thanks Tantra!

I hadn't read your comment. Thanks for writing it. I know it's been a while and much water under the bridge, but I want to thank you anyways.

I get that kind of waves of anger followed by waves of forgiveness (or Peace as I might now call it) phenomenon happening to me too. Now I think that it's good for me to feel the anger at all. Generally I don't, but my health pays for it as it works underground and beneath my awareness. It's remarkably destructive when it works that way. It can take a while for me to figure out the source and face the fear of confronting it. Nothing like a badly hurting body to motivate! Smile

Hi Arnold

It was delighting reading your post today. Are you still a Osho's Sanyassin? I love Osho too; he changed my life and parent's too. We listen to his discourses everyday online. His discourses have helped me tremendously and now I have been able to go deeper and deeper in meditation.

Hi Rak173

Yes, yesterday I celebrated my 26th sannyas birthday. I was one of the last people to take sannyas on the Ranch. After he left his body many of us kinda figured we should move on. It just doesn't seem to happen for me. I explore other approaches to religiousness occasionally, but I always feel thrilled when I read something of his, or watch a video, or do one of his many meditation techniques. I'm very isolated from other sannyasins, (there is only one other in town and she tends to be out of town alot) but he's still very much in my heart.

Nice meeting you!

Namaste!

Arnold

Nice to see you.

Wow, 26 years - great, I am not even that old. lol. Yes his meditation techniques are quite a lot and so we can choose whatever works for us. Osho's popularity increased more after he left his body. Osho's teaching is all about mixing spiritual life with the outer (lay) life. One does not need to go to his ashram/resort in order to take advantage of his teachings. Have you been to his ashram in Pune? I wish I was lucky enough to meet him.

Namaste!

Pune

Yes, I visited the ashram in Pune in late 1987/early 1988. I spent about 3 months there. Osho was still speaking at the time. No Dimensions and Mystic Rose were in their early stages at that time. It was before the White Robe brotherhood celebrations started.

I am very glad and feel very lucky that I got to sit at his feet and listen to him speak while he still had a body. On the other hand, I sometimes felt jealous of the people who were physically closer to him than I was. I also feel badly that I missed him around the time he left his body. I would have liked to have been in Pune then. So you see, I'm not sure it makes a difference how close we are, our minds will always find something better to long for. There are people who died before he was born and people who had better opportunities than I did and never took them. I sense my connection is primarily one of the heart and that requires no body at all. I get the sense that you know that connection too. Smile

Namaste, my friend,

Thanks for writing.